Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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Most people with significant collections usually use one of the auction houses, I believe?
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It depends on whether you are trying to dispose of the entire collection, or parts of it. I'm also assuming your collection is not one that would make a "Top 10" list of France collections.
France has been down for well over a decade, although some of the high-value (>$1000) stamps have recovered.
Not sure of your definition of "rare", but if you take the high value items out and take them to one of the larger auction houses, selling prices for most sound VF (full margin) stamps are typically 25%-40% of catalog. Keep in mind, the big-name auction houses charge a pretty hefty selling commission, typically 25%+. They will attract higher bids for those items compared to smaller auction houses, but to offset the commission, you pretty much can only submit high quality high value items.
If you are trying to sell the entire France collection, I would probably avoid a large auction house. Most bidders at the large auction houses are looking to fill holes in their collections with high quality items. Most will be bidding on the premium items in your collection and then adding a token amount as their max bid for the rest of the collection. If selling as an intact collection, you can expect to get 5%-15% of total catalog value, depending on what your "rare" items are.
If you go the auction house route, whether intact collection or piecemeal, definitely spend time reviewing the France listings and prices realized for the auction house you are contemplating. Most reputable auction houses will have a recent history of auctions/realizations available online. Ignore "estimates" as a seller, since a lot of stamps sold DO NOT reach the estimate, and the estimate does not include commission costs. Since they also post their commission rates, you can figure out how much the original owner actually got.
Best wishes!
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Very helpful suggestions thanks to KHJ, I shall post a selection of what I believe could be considered rare items.
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I
HAVE POSTED TWO OF WHAT MIGHT BE CONSIDERED RARE ITEMS, WOULD WELCOME ANY COMMENTS
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Very nice!
Sorry, I don't collect covers, so I won't be of any help. Lots of others here who can definitely chime in. I'd also be interested in what they say...
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This is not what I was expecting. Wow. Beautiful covers. I am no expert so I can't advise you how to sell it.
The most important thing you can do though is whenever you refer to your collection make sure to reference that it is a "Postal History" collection.
I think I can speak for most of us when I say I was expecting just the stamps on an album page. Postage stamps and postal history are treated very differently, so maybe I think the best advice I can give is that you be sure to be clear about what type of collection you have.
Also some people may have no interest in postage stamps but have a great interest in postal history and visa versa.
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a stamp doesn't lose its value on cover, it can only be enhanced. I don't know French covers, but I suspect if they were US covers, they'd claim princely fees, especially as they document the Franco-Prusssian War and the loss of A/L.
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I collect France fairly seriously. I have not really seen it's market anymore down than most European countries. Although I do not really covers, I do have quite a few Ceres and Napoleon covers, most with multiple franking and none of them have all that much value. Of course many do and it would require some digging to find similar ones to yours to establish a relative value. Finding a French or German auction house would probably be your best bet for determining value. Sending them scans of what you have will quickly let you know which ones would be most desirable.
As for a large single stamp collection it is more telling to know what is missing than what it contains. What major number stamps are you missing in regular Semi Postal and Air? What are the 10 best stamps in the collection? I so do wish there was any easy answer to your question. If you could answer those questions and a scan of the first page and next best or two pages it would be easier to give a more educated answer of how to market them. Selling intact is not often the best way to go. For instance if you have a Scott #9 you would want to sell it separately if it was without major faults. If damaged you might want to sell it with the collection. If the collection does not sell intact then you have to make the choice where you draw the line.
Whichever way you go you will probably end up questioning your decision.
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Hello
Just for your information I bought the standalone Yv 51 for 10$, the 53 for 7$, and the 55 for 1 $, the Alsace for 4 $. The one to Belfort, I'd love to have it. The French stamp (Yv 60) costs 2 $, but I do not know the German one.
I hope this helps
Michel
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Most of these issues have been signed
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Wow, I collect France and I must say I am very impressed. This is top notch material.
Some quality material here!!!!
A serious Auction house would break up the most valuable material and list them individually. The rest would then be sold as a collection. This would bring in more than selling the whole collection without breaking out the choice pieces. You may have enough valuable material to be featured in an Auction Specialty listing featuring the collection. Again, I recommend you reach out to an Auction house or two, to get a reading. Typically you may get more than 25% of catalog (after commissions), if your material is exceptional. The best I ever realized was 30%...but it would have been more had they separated the top valued items and sold them by themselves. But having certificates improves your value, and mine were lacking.
The Westpex Show is held April 27-30 near the SF Airport. Schuyler Rumsey runs a 4 day Auction of top notch material, and you may want to look at their catalog, and contact them. Other reputable auction houses may also be interested, so shop around.
And it does look interesting!!!!
rrr...
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Hi collectors I am very impressed with your comments and suggestions which I do find very helpful,it would seem I should contact the SF auction house to get a reading on the market.
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FYI:
http://www.rumseyauctions.com/auctions
The Westpex catalog will be available in 2-3 weeks, and you can request one to be mailed to you.
rrr...
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From looking at the excellent pages you have shown, I would recommend finding an auction house you are comfortable with and let them break it down as they see fit. The key items like the mint #2a and #21 pair should be offered by themselves as well as the other mint singles, #21, #2's and #1's. The remaining used stamps excepting those with valuable cancels would probably be offered by the page or group. #2's generally seem to have tight margins as yours mint one appears to have and of course having gum or not as well as faults will probably be the biggest factors on how much the entire group shown will realize.
Last week I passed up a lot that had 15 used #6's with a start of $23. Most of the stamps appeared to be in good shape but the lot had no takers. Similar lots of #3 had the same results.
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You may be surprised at the listing on the first 2 covers.
The Alsace may be the best one. Depending on the type, Alsace multiples on covers often list in the $1000++ range. The potential market may however be small.
The multiple Ceres also has very good potential especially given the provenance.
It is no secret that prices for individuals and those on covers, especially multiples with history have no relationship to each other. Most of the Alsace on common auctions are forgeries anyway.
Probably the best solution as noted is to list with a good auction house and let them decide how best to break it up as singles and lots.
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I have never had the pleasure of owning items of the calibre you have shown.
However as a ( very rough ) rule of thumb, the most valuable material usually attracts the best prices in it's country of origin - it is simply a matter of market size. There will be more collectors of classic France in France than in any other country. Therefore the competition for the really scarce material will inevitably push up the price. However contrarily the slightly more common but still globally scarce material will most likely be in all the collections of the target market already. The more common material is best lotted up into suitable lots ( big enough to give you a good return, but small enough to be affordable to the average or above average collector) and auctioned on the net French E-bay or Delcampe might be a good outlet.
Sorry if this is not helpful, but these matters are seldom simple. If you are a French speaker it might be worth contacting a French forum. With all due respect to the people here, you need to be able to tap into multiple opinions of French specialists.
Malcolm
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I'd agree with Malcolm.
For premium items such as the covers, you will get the best auction prices in France, as Malcolm stated. However, you will also have to factor in things like tax (there AND here), exchange rate, commission, shipping costs, loss risk... Make sure you add up all these things before you make a final decision.
Best wishes, and please remember to update us on the results!
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If money is the driving factor, then selling is usually the necessary route to follow. If money is not the main factor, then a bunch of other options may be worth a look. Rather than boring anyone with unasked for options, let me know if this line of thinking would be of any value.
Best,
Dan C.
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Hi Please let me know the other options, maybe for example trading etc;?
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Trading is advantageous in that you are cutting out the middleman, so both parties benefit.
But as Chris points out, you will run into some basic difficulties given the caliber of your items:
1. Finding a trading partner that has material of the same high premium level as yours
2. That trading partner having high premium material you are interested in
3. Establishing the terms for an equitable trade
I've actually had some good results trading with dealers, believe it or not. If a dealer has some hard to sell premium items that you are interested in, and the dealer believes he will have an easier time selling your premium material, you may be able to strike a trade that makes both of you happy.
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06:39:02pm
I have extensive French collection which I wish to sell with many rare issues,I am reluctant to post on e-bay,any suggestions? advice welcomed
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re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Most people with significant collections usually use one of the auction houses, I believe?
Login to Like
this post
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
It depends on whether you are trying to dispose of the entire collection, or parts of it. I'm also assuming your collection is not one that would make a "Top 10" list of France collections.
France has been down for well over a decade, although some of the high-value (>$1000) stamps have recovered.
Not sure of your definition of "rare", but if you take the high value items out and take them to one of the larger auction houses, selling prices for most sound VF (full margin) stamps are typically 25%-40% of catalog. Keep in mind, the big-name auction houses charge a pretty hefty selling commission, typically 25%+. They will attract higher bids for those items compared to smaller auction houses, but to offset the commission, you pretty much can only submit high quality high value items.
If you are trying to sell the entire France collection, I would probably avoid a large auction house. Most bidders at the large auction houses are looking to fill holes in their collections with high quality items. Most will be bidding on the premium items in your collection and then adding a token amount as their max bid for the rest of the collection. If selling as an intact collection, you can expect to get 5%-15% of total catalog value, depending on what your "rare" items are.
If you go the auction house route, whether intact collection or piecemeal, definitely spend time reviewing the France listings and prices realized for the auction house you are contemplating. Most reputable auction houses will have a recent history of auctions/realizations available online. Ignore "estimates" as a seller, since a lot of stamps sold DO NOT reach the estimate, and the estimate does not include commission costs. Since they also post their commission rates, you can figure out how much the original owner actually got.
Best wishes!
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10:08:50pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Very helpful suggestions thanks to KHJ, I shall post a selection of what I believe could be considered rare items.
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02:10:41pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
I HAVE POSTED TWO OF WHAT MIGHT BE CONSIDERED RARE ITEMS, WOULD WELCOME ANY COMMENTS
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re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Very nice!
Sorry, I don't collect covers, so I won't be of any help. Lots of others here who can definitely chime in. I'd also be interested in what they say...
1 Member
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re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
This is not what I was expecting. Wow. Beautiful covers. I am no expert so I can't advise you how to sell it.
The most important thing you can do though is whenever you refer to your collection make sure to reference that it is a "Postal History" collection.
I think I can speak for most of us when I say I was expecting just the stamps on an album page. Postage stamps and postal history are treated very differently, so maybe I think the best advice I can give is that you be sure to be clear about what type of collection you have.
Also some people may have no interest in postage stamps but have a great interest in postal history and visa versa.
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Auctions
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
a stamp doesn't lose its value on cover, it can only be enhanced. I don't know French covers, but I suspect if they were US covers, they'd claim princely fees, especially as they document the Franco-Prusssian War and the loss of A/L.
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re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
I collect France fairly seriously. I have not really seen it's market anymore down than most European countries. Although I do not really covers, I do have quite a few Ceres and Napoleon covers, most with multiple franking and none of them have all that much value. Of course many do and it would require some digging to find similar ones to yours to establish a relative value. Finding a French or German auction house would probably be your best bet for determining value. Sending them scans of what you have will quickly let you know which ones would be most desirable.
As for a large single stamp collection it is more telling to know what is missing than what it contains. What major number stamps are you missing in regular Semi Postal and Air? What are the 10 best stamps in the collection? I so do wish there was any easy answer to your question. If you could answer those questions and a scan of the first page and next best or two pages it would be easier to give a more educated answer of how to market them. Selling intact is not often the best way to go. For instance if you have a Scott #9 you would want to sell it separately if it was without major faults. If damaged you might want to sell it with the collection. If the collection does not sell intact then you have to make the choice where you draw the line.
Whichever way you go you will probably end up questioning your decision.
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09:51:53am
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re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Hello
Just for your information I bought the standalone Yv 51 for 10$, the 53 for 7$, and the 55 for 1 $, the Alsace for 4 $. The one to Belfort, I'd love to have it. The French stamp (Yv 60) costs 2 $, but I do not know the German one.
I hope this helps
Michel
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11:01:26am
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Most of these issues have been signed
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Retired Ap. Book Mod, Pres Golden Gate Stamp Club, Hi Tech Consultant
22 Mar 2017
01:26:36pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Wow, I collect France and I must say I am very impressed. This is top notch material.
Some quality material here!!!!
A serious Auction house would break up the most valuable material and list them individually. The rest would then be sold as a collection. This would bring in more than selling the whole collection without breaking out the choice pieces. You may have enough valuable material to be featured in an Auction Specialty listing featuring the collection. Again, I recommend you reach out to an Auction house or two, to get a reading. Typically you may get more than 25% of catalog (after commissions), if your material is exceptional. The best I ever realized was 30%...but it would have been more had they separated the top valued items and sold them by themselves. But having certificates improves your value, and mine were lacking.
The Westpex Show is held April 27-30 near the SF Airport. Schuyler Rumsey runs a 4 day Auction of top notch material, and you may want to look at their catalog, and contact them. Other reputable auction houses may also be interested, so shop around.
And it does look interesting!!!!
rrr...
1 Member
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02:00:46pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Hi collectors I am very impressed with your comments and suggestions which I do find very helpful,it would seem I should contact the SF auction house to get a reading on the market.
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Retired Ap. Book Mod, Pres Golden Gate Stamp Club, Hi Tech Consultant
22 Mar 2017
03:53:56pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
FYI:
http://www.rumseyauctions.com/auctions
The Westpex catalog will be available in 2-3 weeks, and you can request one to be mailed to you.
rrr...
Login to Like
this post
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
From looking at the excellent pages you have shown, I would recommend finding an auction house you are comfortable with and let them break it down as they see fit. The key items like the mint #2a and #21 pair should be offered by themselves as well as the other mint singles, #21, #2's and #1's. The remaining used stamps excepting those with valuable cancels would probably be offered by the page or group. #2's generally seem to have tight margins as yours mint one appears to have and of course having gum or not as well as faults will probably be the biggest factors on how much the entire group shown will realize.
Last week I passed up a lot that had 15 used #6's with a start of $23. Most of the stamps appeared to be in good shape but the lot had no takers. Similar lots of #3 had the same results.
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02:45:39pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
You may be surprised at the listing on the first 2 covers.
The Alsace may be the best one. Depending on the type, Alsace multiples on covers often list in the $1000++ range. The potential market may however be small.
The multiple Ceres also has very good potential especially given the provenance.
It is no secret that prices for individuals and those on covers, especially multiples with history have no relationship to each other. Most of the Alsace on common auctions are forgeries anyway.
Probably the best solution as noted is to list with a good auction house and let them decide how best to break it up as singles and lots.
Login to Like
this post
02:12:02pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
I have never had the pleasure of owning items of the calibre you have shown.
However as a ( very rough ) rule of thumb, the most valuable material usually attracts the best prices in it's country of origin - it is simply a matter of market size. There will be more collectors of classic France in France than in any other country. Therefore the competition for the really scarce material will inevitably push up the price. However contrarily the slightly more common but still globally scarce material will most likely be in all the collections of the target market already. The more common material is best lotted up into suitable lots ( big enough to give you a good return, but small enough to be affordable to the average or above average collector) and auctioned on the net French E-bay or Delcampe might be a good outlet.
Sorry if this is not helpful, but these matters are seldom simple. If you are a French speaker it might be worth contacting a French forum. With all due respect to the people here, you need to be able to tap into multiple opinions of French specialists.
Malcolm
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this post
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
I'd agree with Malcolm.
For premium items such as the covers, you will get the best auction prices in France, as Malcolm stated. However, you will also have to factor in things like tax (there AND here), exchange rate, commission, shipping costs, loss risk... Make sure you add up all these things before you make a final decision.
Best wishes, and please remember to update us on the results!
Login to Like
this post
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
If money is the driving factor, then selling is usually the necessary route to follow. If money is not the main factor, then a bunch of other options may be worth a look. Rather than boring anyone with unasked for options, let me know if this line of thinking would be of any value.
Best,
Dan C.
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06:49:23pm
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Hi Please let me know the other options, maybe for example trading etc;?
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this post
re: French specialized collection from number 1 advice on selling
Trading is advantageous in that you are cutting out the middleman, so both parties benefit.
But as Chris points out, you will run into some basic difficulties given the caliber of your items:
1. Finding a trading partner that has material of the same high premium level as yours
2. That trading partner having high premium material you are interested in
3. Establishing the terms for an equitable trade
I've actually had some good results trading with dealers, believe it or not. If a dealer has some hard to sell premium items that you are interested in, and the dealer believes he will have an easier time selling your premium material, you may be able to strike a trade that makes both of you happy.
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