Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I have a question regarding how perfin patterns were registered. To keep it as simple as possible, I'll refer to one pattern I am working on in my files, and that is the pattern used by The "Merchantile National Bank" (MNB) that reads "M N B", in a descending order. I know that the pattern was registered by the Merchantile National Bank, but, it was also used by the "American Trust Company" (ATC) in San Francisco. Now, my question is, once a pattern was registered, or applied for, how did the company allow the use by the second party? What I am asking is, was the MNB allowed to rent, or resell its' pattern to another user?
Did the ATC have to pay a fee for using the MNB pattern and, also, did it also have to be registered? I know that the "Cummins Perfing Company did the vast majority of patterns (or all, though I'm not sure) but did they , the ATC that is, register this pattern as well?
You would normally look under "M" for the MNB pattern but would not know that the user was the ATC?? I hope I explained this ok?
The two companies I mentioned are, of course, not the only ones that did this. Major companies such as General Electric, AT & T etc., and others that had multiple offices across the continent practiced this as well.
Any help would be appreciated
Chimo
Bujutsu
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I suspect that if you can identify the correct Merchantile National Bank and the correct American Trust Company you will find that a merger occurred around the time of the pattern usage changing.
The trick is identifying the correct banks because at that time they were all intrastate and there would be several with the same basic name in different states, some related, some not. But then original research is part of the fun - I've found a few covers that would be "discovery" covers to positively confirm who used the pattern..... it is interesting but time consuming..
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I don't know if perfins were like trademarks and were limited to the one company.
In my UK perfin catalogue there were a vast number of organisations, from public bodies to companies that used the same initials that were the same size, with the same number of holes.
For Example:- The Letters BC, 4.5mm high, with 11 and 7 holes were used from Bristol Corporation, to Alfred J Burrows and some 21 other organisations!!
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Thanks all for your help. There is still a lot of researching to be done. Goes with the turf I guess?
Chimo
Bujutsu
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"Perfins were authorized for use in the United States on May 8, 1908. The current Domestic Mail Manual of the U.S. Postal Service notes that postage stamps may be perforated if individual holes do not exceed 1/32 of an inch in diameter and the total design does not occupy more than a 1/2-square- inch area."
Quoted from https://www.nytimes.com/1984/11/04/arts/stamps-what-the-holes-mean.html
From that information it seems clear that there was no regulation as to specific perfin designs as long as they conformed with the general requirements provided.
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Thanks for that smauggie. Good useful information.
Chimo
Bujutsu
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I hope this is the right forum for this particular question?
I have a question regarding how perfin patterns were registered. To keep it as simple as possible, I'll refer to one pattern I am working on in my files, and that is the pattern used by The "Merchantile National Bank" (MNB) that reads "M N B", in a descending order. I know that the pattern was registered by the Merchantile National Bank, but, it was also used by the "American Trust Company" (ATC) in San Francisco. Now, my question is, once a pattern was registered, or applied for, how did the company allow the use by the second party? What I am asking is, was the MNB allowed to rent, or resell its' pattern to another user?
Did the ATC have to pay a fee for using the MNB pattern and, also, did it also have to be registered? I know that the "Cummins Perfing Company did the vast majority of patterns (or all, though I'm not sure) but did they , the ATC that is, register this pattern as well?
You would normally look under "M" for the MNB pattern but would not know that the user was the ATC?? I hope I explained this ok?
The two companies I mentioned are, of course, not the only ones that did this. Major companies such as General Electric, AT & T etc., and others that had multiple offices across the continent practiced this as well.
Any help would be appreciated
Chimo
Bujutsu
Login to Like
this post
re: Perfin Pattern Usages
I suspect that if you can identify the correct Merchantile National Bank and the correct American Trust Company you will find that a merger occurred around the time of the pattern usage changing.
The trick is identifying the correct banks because at that time they were all intrastate and there would be several with the same basic name in different states, some related, some not. But then original research is part of the fun - I've found a few covers that would be "discovery" covers to positively confirm who used the pattern..... it is interesting but time consuming..
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Auctions - Approvals
re: Perfin Pattern Usages
I don't know if perfins were like trademarks and were limited to the one company.
In my UK perfin catalogue there were a vast number of organisations, from public bodies to companies that used the same initials that were the same size, with the same number of holes.
For Example:- The Letters BC, 4.5mm high, with 11 and 7 holes were used from Bristol Corporation, to Alfred J Burrows and some 21 other organisations!!
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re: Perfin Pattern Usages
Thanks all for your help. There is still a lot of researching to be done. Goes with the turf I guess?
Chimo
Bujutsu
Login to Like
this post
re: Perfin Pattern Usages
"Perfins were authorized for use in the United States on May 8, 1908. The current Domestic Mail Manual of the U.S. Postal Service notes that postage stamps may be perforated if individual holes do not exceed 1/32 of an inch in diameter and the total design does not occupy more than a 1/2-square- inch area."
Quoted from https://www.nytimes.com/1984/11/04/arts/stamps-what-the-holes-mean.html
From that information it seems clear that there was no regulation as to specific perfin designs as long as they conformed with the general requirements provided.
Login to Like
this post
re: Perfin Pattern Usages
Thanks for that smauggie. Good useful information.
Chimo
Bujutsu
Login to Like
this post