Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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I'm after the 9d platypus watermark, I just want to know does the watermark go sideway on the stamp or inverted Thankyou
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The platypus stamp, according to Stanley Gibbons comes in three types:
Design type = 35
SG #173 is watermarked sideways
SG #191 is watermarked sideways and shows the crown to the left of the "C of A"
SG #230c is unwatermarked
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Thankyou for the information as this has been a big help to me Thankyou
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Hi Pooh
The 9d Platypus is part of a three set Zoological series. The 5d Ram is the only stamp in the three set series not included in the 1956 set.
The 9d Kookaburra stamp in the Fauna features was issued to replace the 9d Kangaroo and Map definitive, but since supplies of the latter were considerable, the issue of the 9d Platypus stamp was delayed for awhile. The Platypus stamp was originally printed in November 1937 and was not released for sale until September 1, 1938.
There are 3 types, the first type was issued in 1938, it has a sideways multiple watermark C of A with the top of the crown facing left. In the 2019 ACSC it is catalogued 205.
The second type was issued in 1943, it also has a sideways multiple watermark C of A but with the top of the crown facing right. In the 2019 ACSC it is catalogued 206.
The third type was issued in 1956, it was printed without a watermark. In the 2019 ACSC it is catalogued 207.
Rob
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Rob, your description of the watermarks with the ACSC catalog seems to differ a little from the Gibbons description, or could it possibly be an error in the Gibbons description when it says:
"SG #191 is watermarked sideways and shows the crown to the left of the "C of A""
Showing the crown to the left of the "C of A", is this possibly language difference between the "King's English", and "Real English"?
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Hi Michael
Here in Australia we do not actually speak the Queen's English (we do not have a King - yet), there is actually English training manuals teaching people to speak Australian English, and what is real English?
Here is the information from the 2019 ACSC word for word:
First issue 1938: Watermark multiple Crown and C of A sideways, top of crown facing left (Type 6).
Second issue 1943: Watermark multiple Crown and C of A sideways, top of crown facing right (Type 6).
Third issue 1956: No watermark.
The ACSC doesn't mention the crown being on the left of the C of A, but if you look at the watermark, the crown is actually above the C of A, as it is set in a vertical position where the crown is in central position above the C of A.
Rob
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Thanks. I think you have a typo where you show the two watermarked stamps as a Type 6 watermark. Right now I don't see the difference with right or left facing top of crowns.
Scott shows the three stamps as:
Scott #174; Watermark 228; Perf 14x15
Scott #174a; Watermark 228; Perf 14x13.5
Scott #298; unwatermarked
Scott makes no distinction between the watermarks, permitting the perforations make the difference between the two stamps.
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I reckon you are both correct, the crown is to the left of the letter C but also above the word OF.
Could it be that SG states how the watermark is from the face rather than the rear of the stamp.
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That might be it, as Scott shows watermarks how they look from the back of the stamp as that is how watermarks are normally viewed. hat's probably where I was missing it in my mind.
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12:23:00pm
" ...Could it be that SG states how the watermark is from the face rather than the rear of the stamp. ..."
S Gibbons, fine print in the introduction; Watermark as seen from the front
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02:56:15pm
It took me a few minutes to look this up as the
RN arrived to see if I am still alive and to wrap
some pesky re-ocurring ankle wounds.
So while I think Gibbons is clear as mud,
Scott is not that clear either, as their watermark
illustrations in the introductions are from the
front which would not be very visible once the stamp
is printed.
However this sentence is there;
".... Watermarks may be found normal, reversed,
inverted, inverted reversed, and sideways as
seen from the back of the stamp...."
Volume Three of Ken Wood's seminal "This is Philately",
the essential encyclopedia of stamping,
which you all know I keep by my bedside,
uses the same verbiage as Gibbons;".... as
seen from the back of the stamp. ...." as well.
This all begs the question, when you state that a
samp has a sideways watermark with the crown
to the right, do you mean when seen from the back.
or as would be seen if the printed image were
transparent or you had X-ray vision and the Scott
illustrations of single line or double line watermarks
are presented.
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Model railroading has universal standards. Too bad philately doesn't. 
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The perforation of the 1938 issue is 14 x 13.5 (Platypus & Merino sheep), and 13.5 x 14 for the rest of the zoological set of the 1938 issue, this was the standard perforation gauge of that series of stamps.
From 1943 until 1956 the standard perforation gauge for the zoological series was 14 x 14.75.
At the meeting Michael Drury, a renowned expert of KGV stamps and Dr. Geoff Kellow and the Juzwins view stamps from the front.
It does seem a little odd for the different angles of the stamp (facing right and left) to be the same Type 6, another question to discuss at the meeting of the ACCC on May 20.
Stamp collecting may be the hobby of Kings but the 2019 edition of the ACSC is fast becoming the King of typos and missing entries.
"May God save the Queen, but no-one will save the editors of the 2019 ACSC" - I thought a little twist from Prime Minister Gough Whitlam's (pronounced Goff) parting words on the steps of Parliament House on November 11, 1975 after being dismissed by Governor-General Sir John Kerr an appropriate description when the ACCC meets up this month.
Rob
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"".... Watermarks may be found normal, reversed, inverted, inverted reversed, and sideways as seen from the back of the stamp....""
Correction: The watermark is viewed from the back.
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Hi Pooh
"I'm after the 9d platypus watermark, I just want to know does the watermark go sideway on the stamp or inverted Thankyou"
The watermark on the Platypus is sideways only. Even though there have been extremely rare occurrences in which a watermark has been accidentally inverted; there is no recording of this being the case with the 9d Platypus.
Rob
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Stanley Gibbons watermark references are all from the front.
This is quite logical as the STAMP is normally viewed from the front "in real life " i.e.when it is in the stamp clerk's book or on an envelope in the post.
The fact that you look at the stamp on the obverse when you are looking for a watermark is irrelevant to it's real orientation.
Having re-read this I know what I mean, but I am not sure that you will!!! I am out of practice writing proper English, as when I used to write instructions to staff in manner which was impossible to misunderstand.
Malcolm
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I mentioned earlier that the watermark should be read from the front but soon crossed it out and corrected the comment by stating the watermark should be read from the back, and why did I do this?
I spoke to the Juzwins, Geoff Kellow, Michael Drury, and Chris Ceremuga, and all said that the watermark should be read from the back. These people are renowned experts in their field, so a watermark must be read from the back not front.
SG may say that the stamp should be read from the front, but I’ll place my money on the words of these four experts.
Rob
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09:25:53pm
Could someone please tell me the watermarks on the I think they are called Zoological stamps which way does the watermark go?? Thankyou
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12:04:33am
re: Platypus stamps
I'm after the 9d platypus watermark, I just want to know does the watermark go sideway on the stamp or inverted Thankyou
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re: Platypus stamps
The platypus stamp, according to Stanley Gibbons comes in three types:
Design type = 35
SG #173 is watermarked sideways
SG #191 is watermarked sideways and shows the crown to the left of the "C of A"
SG #230c is unwatermarked
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02:18:57am
re: Platypus stamps
Thankyou for the information as this has been a big help to me Thankyou
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Member ACCC (Australian Commonwealth Collectors Club of NSW)
05 May 2019
04:22:33am
re: Platypus stamps
Hi Pooh
The 9d Platypus is part of a three set Zoological series. The 5d Ram is the only stamp in the three set series not included in the 1956 set.
The 9d Kookaburra stamp in the Fauna features was issued to replace the 9d Kangaroo and Map definitive, but since supplies of the latter were considerable, the issue of the 9d Platypus stamp was delayed for awhile. The Platypus stamp was originally printed in November 1937 and was not released for sale until September 1, 1938.
There are 3 types, the first type was issued in 1938, it has a sideways multiple watermark C of A with the top of the crown facing left. In the 2019 ACSC it is catalogued 205.
The second type was issued in 1943, it also has a sideways multiple watermark C of A but with the top of the crown facing right. In the 2019 ACSC it is catalogued 206.
The third type was issued in 1956, it was printed without a watermark. In the 2019 ACSC it is catalogued 207.
Rob
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re: Platypus stamps
Rob, your description of the watermarks with the ACSC catalog seems to differ a little from the Gibbons description, or could it possibly be an error in the Gibbons description when it says:
"SG #191 is watermarked sideways and shows the crown to the left of the "C of A""
Showing the crown to the left of the "C of A", is this possibly language difference between the "King's English", and "Real English"?
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Member ACCC (Australian Commonwealth Collectors Club of NSW)
06 May 2019
06:58:13am
re: Platypus stamps
Hi Michael
Here in Australia we do not actually speak the Queen's English (we do not have a King - yet), there is actually English training manuals teaching people to speak Australian English, and what is real English?
Here is the information from the 2019 ACSC word for word:
First issue 1938: Watermark multiple Crown and C of A sideways, top of crown facing left (Type 6).
Second issue 1943: Watermark multiple Crown and C of A sideways, top of crown facing right (Type 6).
Third issue 1956: No watermark.
The ACSC doesn't mention the crown being on the left of the C of A, but if you look at the watermark, the crown is actually above the C of A, as it is set in a vertical position where the crown is in central position above the C of A.
Rob
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re: Platypus stamps
Thanks. I think you have a typo where you show the two watermarked stamps as a Type 6 watermark. Right now I don't see the difference with right or left facing top of crowns.
Scott shows the three stamps as:
Scott #174; Watermark 228; Perf 14x15
Scott #174a; Watermark 228; Perf 14x13.5
Scott #298; unwatermarked
Scott makes no distinction between the watermarks, permitting the perforations make the difference between the two stamps.
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re: Platypus stamps
I reckon you are both correct, the crown is to the left of the letter C but also above the word OF.
Could it be that SG states how the watermark is from the face rather than the rear of the stamp.
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re: Platypus stamps
That might be it, as Scott shows watermarks how they look from the back of the stamp as that is how watermarks are normally viewed. hat's probably where I was missing it in my mind.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
06 May 2019
12:23:00pm
re: Platypus stamps
" ...Could it be that SG states how the watermark is from the face rather than the rear of the stamp. ..."
S Gibbons, fine print in the introduction; Watermark as seen from the front
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
06 May 2019
02:56:15pm
re: Platypus stamps
It took me a few minutes to look this up as the
RN arrived to see if I am still alive and to wrap
some pesky re-ocurring ankle wounds.
So while I think Gibbons is clear as mud,
Scott is not that clear either, as their watermark
illustrations in the introductions are from the
front which would not be very visible once the stamp
is printed.
However this sentence is there;
".... Watermarks may be found normal, reversed,
inverted, inverted reversed, and sideways as
seen from the back of the stamp...."
Volume Three of Ken Wood's seminal "This is Philately",
the essential encyclopedia of stamping,
which you all know I keep by my bedside,
uses the same verbiage as Gibbons;".... as
seen from the back of the stamp. ...." as well.
This all begs the question, when you state that a
samp has a sideways watermark with the crown
to the right, do you mean when seen from the back.
or as would be seen if the printed image were
transparent or you had X-ray vision and the Scott
illustrations of single line or double line watermarks
are presented.
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re: Platypus stamps
Model railroading has universal standards. Too bad philately doesn't.
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Member ACCC (Australian Commonwealth Collectors Club of NSW)
06 May 2019
04:36:27pm
re: Platypus stamps
The perforation of the 1938 issue is 14 x 13.5 (Platypus & Merino sheep), and 13.5 x 14 for the rest of the zoological set of the 1938 issue, this was the standard perforation gauge of that series of stamps.
From 1943 until 1956 the standard perforation gauge for the zoological series was 14 x 14.75.
At the meeting Michael Drury, a renowned expert of KGV stamps and Dr. Geoff Kellow and the Juzwins view stamps from the front.
It does seem a little odd for the different angles of the stamp (facing right and left) to be the same Type 6, another question to discuss at the meeting of the ACCC on May 20.
Stamp collecting may be the hobby of Kings but the 2019 edition of the ACSC is fast becoming the King of typos and missing entries.
"May God save the Queen, but no-one will save the editors of the 2019 ACSC" - I thought a little twist from Prime Minister Gough Whitlam's (pronounced Goff) parting words on the steps of Parliament House on November 11, 1975 after being dismissed by Governor-General Sir John Kerr an appropriate description when the ACCC meets up this month.
Rob
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Member ACCC (Australian Commonwealth Collectors Club of NSW)
06 May 2019
04:48:08pm
re: Platypus stamps
"".... Watermarks may be found normal, reversed, inverted, inverted reversed, and sideways as seen from the back of the stamp....""
Correction: The watermark is viewed from the back.
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Member ACCC (Australian Commonwealth Collectors Club of NSW)
06 May 2019
04:57:06pm
re: Platypus stamps
Hi Pooh
"I'm after the 9d platypus watermark, I just want to know does the watermark go sideway on the stamp or inverted Thankyou"
The watermark on the Platypus is sideways only. Even though there have been extremely rare occurrences in which a watermark has been accidentally inverted; there is no recording of this being the case with the 9d Platypus.
Rob
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06:16:42am
re: Platypus stamps
Stanley Gibbons watermark references are all from the front.
This is quite logical as the STAMP is normally viewed from the front "in real life " i.e.when it is in the stamp clerk's book or on an envelope in the post.
The fact that you look at the stamp on the obverse when you are looking for a watermark is irrelevant to it's real orientation.
Having re-read this I know what I mean, but I am not sure that you will!!! I am out of practice writing proper English, as when I used to write instructions to staff in manner which was impossible to misunderstand.
Malcolm
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this post
Member ACCC (Australian Commonwealth Collectors Club of NSW)
17 Jun 2019
12:36:34pm
re: Platypus stamps
I mentioned earlier that the watermark should be read from the front but soon crossed it out and corrected the comment by stating the watermark should be read from the back, and why did I do this?
I spoke to the Juzwins, Geoff Kellow, Michael Drury, and Chris Ceremuga, and all said that the watermark should be read from the back. These people are renowned experts in their field, so a watermark must be read from the back not front.
SG may say that the stamp should be read from the front, but I’ll place my money on the words of these four experts.
Rob
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