Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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Oh, the dreaded "should" rears its head.
You know it's all about what you want, not should. Should only comes into play when you're following some one else's rules for whatever reason: exhibition, sale, storage. If it's strictly for you, do what you want.
For myself, selvage is more important than order, consistency, and appearance. Selvage helps to ID stamps (think of a 2c Washington from the WF series; those with a plate number are immediately and confidently identified by the plate number as a particular stamp because we kept lists of PNs and the stamps associated with those plates) and helps to place it on the sheet (which pane in which position, although more modern stamps often have faulty information, courtesy of some ridiculous decisions by USPS management [thanks, Mr Failor, looking forward to the magic you work at the UN]).
by keeping selvage, you make the stamp more attractive to a small universe of collectors (those who value selvage, PNs, etc), so, I suppose, there is a universal constant that more is better if for no other reason than one can always remove the selvage later, but one can't return it to the stamp once removed.
anyway, i'm one of the minority who prefers selvage to its absence, and will always pick the one with selvage over one without, all other things being equal. but note the key word in this paragraph is MINORITY. Most don't care, and probably more prefer its absence than its presence.
either way, do what you want.
Sal Vatch
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There was actually a big discussion about this back in 2004 (have I really been a member here that long? - Seems like yesterday). It's in the archives. I'm cutting and pasting my reply from back then:
__________________________________________
Blank selvedge can help tell you about the perforation method used for certain issues.
Line Perforations are created by perforating the sheets in one direction then turning the sheet 90 degrees and perforating in the other direction. This causes the perforations to overlap where stamps & selvedge connect. The perforations go to the end of the selvedge. Stamps with comb perforations have at least three sides perforated at one time. There is no overlap where the stamps or selvedge connect. The perforations only partially perforate the selvedge.
One stamp that comes to mind is Scott 1596 which is normally comb perforated and is worth only a few cents. The line perforated version Scot 1596d is worth quite a lot more than the comb perf.
If you go to this link you will readily see why it would be easier to tell the difference between the stamps if you have the selvedge still attached.
http://www.linns.com/howto/refresher/perforations_20001023/rc3_1023_big.jpg
The stamps on the left are 1596, the ones on the right are 1596d. Notice the perforations on 1596d go to the end of the sheet. 1596 only have 1 perforation in the selvedge and the selvedge must be torn to seperate fully.
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With Canadian stamps a selvedge often tells the printer and paper type which really helps when you are trying to identify this type of stamp. There are some Christmas booklet stamps that are identical to the sheet stamps and the only way to identify them is by the narrow selvedge attached to the stamp. These Christmas sheet issues have a wider selvedge than the booklet issues.
Myself I prefer to have the selvedge attached or a corner stamp with two selvedges and the margin inscriptions is even is even better.
This is just a personal preference.
I agree with Sal - One should collect what they want, in the format that pleases themselves not what others tell them they 'should' collect.
Liz
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There is an interesting article on selvedge art on the web site for the Royal Philatelic Society of Canada--rpsc.org--then scroll down to section "On Line Library"--there is a direct link to the above mentioned article
I personally like the selvedge "ON" and have a pet project of reconstructing the panes of 16,20 etc of modern CDN commemoratives with all the selvedge--a difficult task
Note that "Patches" often lists Cnd. items noting in her description that the margins are attached--THX Liz
For those interested I hope you find the article on the RPSC website to be of interest
Harold
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Welll! I will do what I want (smiling). I am all for preserving plate numbers if they are attached to the stamp or block. Ditto with the Mr. Zip, plate position information, etc. However with today's printing techniques just how much information do you acquire with plate numbers consisting of all 1's. It always seemed to me that the plate number collecting was really about potential rarity.
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today's PNs bear no relation to prior PNs because, as you correctly say, Les, they are meaningless, whereas earlier PNs told specific stories. Today's PNs are just numbers bearing no relation to a specific plate; in fact, USPS has said that they might change plates and not a plate number while changing PNs when they change the paper but not the plate. go figure.
This very change is the nail in my personal PN coffin. I sold off the bulk of it to Tom Harley a while ago.
David
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My sense of order gets offended when I have to mount a stamp that has selvage extending outside the space allocated by the album's publisher. Which brings up the question of selvage. Modern stamps are unlikely to increase in value simply because they have extra pieces of paper. Should we as collectors preserve the additional paper?
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Auctions
re: Saving Selvage
Oh, the dreaded "should" rears its head.
You know it's all about what you want, not should. Should only comes into play when you're following some one else's rules for whatever reason: exhibition, sale, storage. If it's strictly for you, do what you want.
For myself, selvage is more important than order, consistency, and appearance. Selvage helps to ID stamps (think of a 2c Washington from the WF series; those with a plate number are immediately and confidently identified by the plate number as a particular stamp because we kept lists of PNs and the stamps associated with those plates) and helps to place it on the sheet (which pane in which position, although more modern stamps often have faulty information, courtesy of some ridiculous decisions by USPS management [thanks, Mr Failor, looking forward to the magic you work at the UN]).
by keeping selvage, you make the stamp more attractive to a small universe of collectors (those who value selvage, PNs, etc), so, I suppose, there is a universal constant that more is better if for no other reason than one can always remove the selvage later, but one can't return it to the stamp once removed.
anyway, i'm one of the minority who prefers selvage to its absence, and will always pick the one with selvage over one without, all other things being equal. but note the key word in this paragraph is MINORITY. Most don't care, and probably more prefer its absence than its presence.
either way, do what you want.
Sal Vatch
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President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org
12 Jul 2011
03:27:09pm
re: Saving Selvage
There was actually a big discussion about this back in 2004 (have I really been a member here that long? - Seems like yesterday). It's in the archives. I'm cutting and pasting my reply from back then:
__________________________________________
Blank selvedge can help tell you about the perforation method used for certain issues.
Line Perforations are created by perforating the sheets in one direction then turning the sheet 90 degrees and perforating in the other direction. This causes the perforations to overlap where stamps & selvedge connect. The perforations go to the end of the selvedge. Stamps with comb perforations have at least three sides perforated at one time. There is no overlap where the stamps or selvedge connect. The perforations only partially perforate the selvedge.
One stamp that comes to mind is Scott 1596 which is normally comb perforated and is worth only a few cents. The line perforated version Scot 1596d is worth quite a lot more than the comb perf.
If you go to this link you will readily see why it would be easier to tell the difference between the stamps if you have the selvedge still attached.
http://www.linns.com/howto/refresher/perforations_20001023/rc3_1023_big.jpg
The stamps on the left are 1596, the ones on the right are 1596d. Notice the perforations on 1596d go to the end of the sheet. 1596 only have 1 perforation in the selvedge and the selvedge must be torn to seperate fully.
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04:37:54pm
Auctions - Approvals
re: Saving Selvage
With Canadian stamps a selvedge often tells the printer and paper type which really helps when you are trying to identify this type of stamp. There are some Christmas booklet stamps that are identical to the sheet stamps and the only way to identify them is by the narrow selvedge attached to the stamp. These Christmas sheet issues have a wider selvedge than the booklet issues.
Myself I prefer to have the selvedge attached or a corner stamp with two selvedges and the margin inscriptions is even is even better.
This is just a personal preference.
I agree with Sal - One should collect what they want, in the format that pleases themselves not what others tell them they 'should' collect.
Liz
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07:34:53pm
re: Saving Selvage
There is an interesting article on selvedge art on the web site for the Royal Philatelic Society of Canada--rpsc.org--then scroll down to section "On Line Library"--there is a direct link to the above mentioned article
I personally like the selvedge "ON" and have a pet project of reconstructing the panes of 16,20 etc of modern CDN commemoratives with all the selvedge--a difficult task
Note that "Patches" often lists Cnd. items noting in her description that the margins are attached--THX Liz
For those interested I hope you find the article on the RPSC website to be of interest
Harold
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this post
re: Saving Selvage
Welll! I will do what I want (smiling). I am all for preserving plate numbers if they are attached to the stamp or block. Ditto with the Mr. Zip, plate position information, etc. However with today's printing techniques just how much information do you acquire with plate numbers consisting of all 1's. It always seemed to me that the plate number collecting was really about potential rarity.
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Auctions
re: Saving Selvage
today's PNs bear no relation to prior PNs because, as you correctly say, Les, they are meaningless, whereas earlier PNs told specific stories. Today's PNs are just numbers bearing no relation to a specific plate; in fact, USPS has said that they might change plates and not a plate number while changing PNs when they change the paper but not the plate. go figure.
This very change is the nail in my personal PN coffin. I sold off the bulk of it to Tom Harley a while ago.
David
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