Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
01:34:54pm
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Hi Lisa,
I collect first day covers but I'm not sure what you are asking. Fleetwood was bought out by Mystic a few years ago. I was just on Mystic's website and now I think I know what you are getting at. It looks like they list several cachet makers for each FDC. Classic, Silk and Fleetwood. Generally Fleetwood is more expensive. Interestingly they just show a copy of the stamp and not the FDC with the cachet.
Fleetwood was/is a cachet maker. Since Mystic purchased them, they have continued the line. My experience has been that Fleetwood cachets are pretty common. The price Mystic is asking for a Scott 2500 (Summer Olympics) is $3.25. I found the complete set of 5 Fleetwood FDC's for the Summer Olympics on Ebay for $4.00. Fleetwood Cachets are very colorful and have information about the stamp subject on the back of the enevelope.
The Silk Cachets are probably Colorano Silk Cachets. I do believe there was another Cachet Maker who created Silk Cachets but Colorano is the most famous and did it first.
Bob
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i was trying to figure out how to answer this question also, and I think Bob hit it on the head when he explained that the after market for Fleetwood and other common cachet makers is much less expensive than most of the initial purchases through Mystic, ArtMaster, and who ever else is still around (Fleetwood, ArtMaster, Unicover were (are) distributors of nice, but common, low-after-market material).
I would emphasize that if price is important, you might, as Bob did, scour the aftermarket. If convenience and/or immediate gratification is more important, Mystic is a good solution.
How'd we do, Lisa, in addressing your question?
David
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11:46:45am
That information and advice was very helpful. Thank you both! Just to clarify, here is a scan of 2 covers they have pictured in the catalog and their listings below. They both say there is a "Fleetwood cachet" and "Printed cachet." Which one is shown? What would the other one look like?
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i must leave the field to others; as i am woefully ignorant, but not for long
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Lisa,
I have no idea what "Printed"' means. The items pictured are Fleetwood covers. When I look up the Sybil Ludington FDC on Mystic's website they have a choice of Fleetwood, Silk and Classic Covers. The Classic being the cheapest. I wonder if that means Uncacheted? There are also Generic cacheted envelopes that collectors would buy that featured a flag - eagle or something else so that they can service their own covers with whatever stamps they want. Maybe that is what "Printed"/"Classic" means. You may want to give them a call to find out.
Bob
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From http://www.mysticstamp.com/faq.asp?id=76
What are "Fleetwood", "Mystic", "Silk" and "Classic" First day Covers
Fleetwood began producing First Day Covers in 1941 with the Vermont Statehood issue. Mystic Stamp Company acquired Fleetwood in 2007 and is proud to continue its tradition of excellence today. Most Fleetwood cachets (designs) are full-color works of original art. Most Fleetwood First Day Covers feature interesting information about the stamp subject. Fleetwood First Day Covers are produced for both commemorative and regular issue U.S. stamps of all denominations.
Mystic began producing First Day Covers in 1992 with the Pledge of Allegiance issue and ended in 2007 with the Henry W. Longfellow issue. With few exceptions, Mystic First Day Covers have full-color cachets, neat information about the stamp subject, and feature commemorative U.S. stamp issues at the first class rate.
“Silk†First Day Covers produced by Colorano were introduced in 1971 with the America’s Wool issue and continue to the present. Each color illustration is printed on satin-finish fabric, fastened to the cover and surrounded by a luxurious gold fabric border. “Silk†First Day Covers feature regular issue and commemorative stamps. They have no additional information about the stamp subject.
Fleetwood, Mystic, and Silk First Day Covers are unaddressed.
Classic First Day Covers are from various sources and can date from the 1920s to the present. Classic covers are interesting because of the diversity of their cachets. Classic First Day Covers may be addressed or unaddressed, illustrated or unillustrated with printed or rubber design in one or more than one color. They may feature regular issue or commemorative stamps.
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Thanks Josh, sounds like Classic/Printed means you are going to get whatever they feel like sending you.
Bob
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An interesting experiment would be to order two or three of the classic FDC and see what you get. I believe Mystic has a 100% money back guarantee if not satisfied.
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Looks like there are quite a few Fleetwood FDC's in the auction.
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Hi Lisa, silks are a material based window cover rather than a printed picture.
So where the picture is on your FDC you will see quite clearly that it is material as it will have a texture.
I would show you one but I do not know how to do it on a reply thread.
Hope this helps
Julian
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Hey you just given me an idea too about my own quest, if Scott produce a FDC Catalog all I need do is find their addy or phone number and ask them.
Lisa is there an Email addy on your catalog, you can put on here????
Just save me trolling the net yet again
Julian
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Dont worry Lisa found it and done it.
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The American First Day Cover Society is always worth a visit.
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For "Printed Cachet" could they mean Artcraft since that was the most common cachet? Even then, those are ENGRAVED rather than printed.
In printed, I would imagine that being covers produced by photo offset printing, aka ink onto an envelope. There were many small cachet producers who did so by that method, including my own ODDITY Cachets line from 1976-78.
In my own collection, now that I'm organizing things, I've been trying to find interesting cachets. I find the Fleetwood, Artcraft and Colorano covers too common and their designs too similar and predictable. I much prefer to dig a bit and find cachets sponsored by local groups, part of an advertising campaign or by the multitudes of small makers who have come and gone.
As far as Mystic's pricing, they are way high to the market. You can buy lots of 100s of first day covers on eBay for a dime apiece. But they seem to cater to new and not so knowledgeable collectors across the board from what I see. Plus, remember they are a full time company with a facility and lots of employees so their overhead requires them to sell things at a large markup.
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It is during our darkest moments that we must focus to see the light. - Aristotle Onassis
14 Sep 2012
01:34:54pm
I just received a Fleetwood catalog and was browsing few. I'm not a cover collector but I did see a few interesting things. However, I do need some clarification if any can help. They list Fleetwood cachets and printed catchets with the Fleetwood being more expensive. What's the difference? They also have silk caches which seem to actually have a piece of with a picture printed on it attached to the envelope. Is that correct? Any and all help is appreciated!
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President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org
15 Sep 2012
07:26:08am
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Hi Lisa,
I collect first day covers but I'm not sure what you are asking. Fleetwood was bought out by Mystic a few years ago. I was just on Mystic's website and now I think I know what you are getting at. It looks like they list several cachet makers for each FDC. Classic, Silk and Fleetwood. Generally Fleetwood is more expensive. Interestingly they just show a copy of the stamp and not the FDC with the cachet.
Fleetwood was/is a cachet maker. Since Mystic purchased them, they have continued the line. My experience has been that Fleetwood cachets are pretty common. The price Mystic is asking for a Scott 2500 (Summer Olympics) is $3.25. I found the complete set of 5 Fleetwood FDC's for the Summer Olympics on Ebay for $4.00. Fleetwood Cachets are very colorful and have information about the stamp subject on the back of the enevelope.
The Silk Cachets are probably Colorano Silk Cachets. I do believe there was another Cachet Maker who created Silk Cachets but Colorano is the most famous and did it first.
Bob
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Auctions
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
i was trying to figure out how to answer this question also, and I think Bob hit it on the head when he explained that the after market for Fleetwood and other common cachet makers is much less expensive than most of the initial purchases through Mystic, ArtMaster, and who ever else is still around (Fleetwood, ArtMaster, Unicover were (are) distributors of nice, but common, low-after-market material).
I would emphasize that if price is important, you might, as Bob did, scour the aftermarket. If convenience and/or immediate gratification is more important, Mystic is a good solution.
How'd we do, Lisa, in addressing your question?
David
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It is during our darkest moments that we must focus to see the light. - Aristotle Onassis
15 Sep 2012
11:46:45am
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
That information and advice was very helpful. Thank you both! Just to clarify, here is a scan of 2 covers they have pictured in the catalog and their listings below. They both say there is a "Fleetwood cachet" and "Printed cachet." Which one is shown? What would the other one look like?
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Auctions
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
i must leave the field to others; as i am woefully ignorant, but not for long
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President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org
15 Sep 2012
01:39:51pm
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Lisa,
I have no idea what "Printed"' means. The items pictured are Fleetwood covers. When I look up the Sybil Ludington FDC on Mystic's website they have a choice of Fleetwood, Silk and Classic Covers. The Classic being the cheapest. I wonder if that means Uncacheted? There are also Generic cacheted envelopes that collectors would buy that featured a flag - eagle or something else so that they can service their own covers with whatever stamps they want. Maybe that is what "Printed"/"Classic" means. You may want to give them a call to find out.
Bob
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re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
From http://www.mysticstamp.com/faq.asp?id=76
What are "Fleetwood", "Mystic", "Silk" and "Classic" First day Covers
Fleetwood began producing First Day Covers in 1941 with the Vermont Statehood issue. Mystic Stamp Company acquired Fleetwood in 2007 and is proud to continue its tradition of excellence today. Most Fleetwood cachets (designs) are full-color works of original art. Most Fleetwood First Day Covers feature interesting information about the stamp subject. Fleetwood First Day Covers are produced for both commemorative and regular issue U.S. stamps of all denominations.
Mystic began producing First Day Covers in 1992 with the Pledge of Allegiance issue and ended in 2007 with the Henry W. Longfellow issue. With few exceptions, Mystic First Day Covers have full-color cachets, neat information about the stamp subject, and feature commemorative U.S. stamp issues at the first class rate.
“Silk†First Day Covers produced by Colorano were introduced in 1971 with the America’s Wool issue and continue to the present. Each color illustration is printed on satin-finish fabric, fastened to the cover and surrounded by a luxurious gold fabric border. “Silk†First Day Covers feature regular issue and commemorative stamps. They have no additional information about the stamp subject.
Fleetwood, Mystic, and Silk First Day Covers are unaddressed.
Classic First Day Covers are from various sources and can date from the 1920s to the present. Classic covers are interesting because of the diversity of their cachets. Classic First Day Covers may be addressed or unaddressed, illustrated or unillustrated with printed or rubber design in one or more than one color. They may feature regular issue or commemorative stamps.
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President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org
15 Sep 2012
08:04:50pm
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Thanks Josh, sounds like Classic/Printed means you are going to get whatever they feel like sending you.
Bob
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re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
An interesting experiment would be to order two or three of the classic FDC and see what you get. I believe Mystic has a 100% money back guarantee if not satisfied.
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President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org
16 Sep 2012
02:33:28pm
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Looks like there are quite a few Fleetwood FDC's in the auction.
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11:48:25am
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Hi Lisa, silks are a material based window cover rather than a printed picture.
So where the picture is on your FDC you will see quite clearly that it is material as it will have a texture.
I would show you one but I do not know how to do it on a reply thread.
Hope this helps
Julian
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12:01:37pm
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Hey you just given me an idea too about my own quest, if Scott produce a FDC Catalog all I need do is find their addy or phone number and ask them.
Lisa is there an Email addy on your catalog, you can put on here????
Just save me trolling the net yet again
Julian
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12:31:58pm
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
Dont worry Lisa found it and done it.
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re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
The American First Day Cover Society is always worth a visit.
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Approvals
re: Fleetwood vs. Printed covers
For "Printed Cachet" could they mean Artcraft since that was the most common cachet? Even then, those are ENGRAVED rather than printed.
In printed, I would imagine that being covers produced by photo offset printing, aka ink onto an envelope. There were many small cachet producers who did so by that method, including my own ODDITY Cachets line from 1976-78.
In my own collection, now that I'm organizing things, I've been trying to find interesting cachets. I find the Fleetwood, Artcraft and Colorano covers too common and their designs too similar and predictable. I much prefer to dig a bit and find cachets sponsored by local groups, part of an advertising campaign or by the multitudes of small makers who have come and gone.
As far as Mystic's pricing, they are way high to the market. You can buy lots of 100s of first day covers on eBay for a dime apiece. But they seem to cater to new and not so knowledgeable collectors across the board from what I see. Plus, remember they are a full time company with a facility and lots of employees so their overhead requires them to sell things at a large markup.
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