Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I have wanted this set for a long time.
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How would you play these?
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First, I wouldn't play them. They wouldn't be "mint" anymore.
They do play at 33 1/3 RPM on any record player. If you remember the stamp collecting video done by Gary Burghoff many years ago, he played one of them on a record player in the video.
They are not just songs. They also include narration about Bhutan and its people.
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How fantastic.. That is a new one on me. Never heard of those before. We're they ever used as actual affixed postage? I assume to make them a postage stamp there was some kind of gum on one side ? I thought my volcanic ash stamps were odd and cool... Might have to track these down.
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I just read that many / most turntables are not able to play these because the swing of the tone arm is not long enough to complete the record.
I found a few samples of what is on these record stamps as well.
This one is a rather boring narration about Bhutan: http://mp3archives.wfmu.org/archive/FL/bhut1.mp3
And this is a little song: http://mp3archives.wfmu.org/archive/FL/bhut2.mp3
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Jere - Bhutan has been a leader in "different" style stamps. However, the record stamps are quite popular and cat at $400. However, you should be able to find them in the $100 to $200 range. They aren't cheap. They also have issued several CD Rom stamps. Those play on computer CD drives.
I used to have a link to the official Bhutan site where you could watch the videos from the Bhutan CD Rom stamps. They were very well done, but I have lost the link. I tried finding the links to the CD Rom and the records. Thanks, Jan for finding the record links.
It is true that the records are on the small size, and players with the auto-reject will not play them correctly. You would have to find a manual turntable to try to play them. If you do, the central hole of the records may be affected by the spindle (remove the spindle if you can before playing) and/or you could scratch the record with the needle. Either way the stamps may not be considered MNH any more if that happens.
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Perhaps splitting hair, but does the distinction of mint vs. used not relate to the use of a stamp for postage? "Playing" the stamp on a record player, therefore, does not constitute using it (philatelically speaking that is)? So, even if played, it is still mint, albeit if playing damages the back -- which we don't know if that would happen -- , the stamp may then be considered mint disturbed gum. MNH does not mean "untouched by human hands." It just means anything touching the back did not leave any visible marks. So, as long as playing leaves no trace, I would still consider the stamps 'MNH.'
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I disagree with your definition.
To me:
Mint = in the condition as if the stamp just left the post office (post office fresh with no damage; never hinged is presumed).
Unused = not used, original gum but no longer "post office fresh" (may include damage in the unused state and can be NH, but it is no longer mint)
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08:04:22am
I am with Arno on this one I think philatelically, playing one of these on a record player, cd player or on your computer wouldn't move it into unused.
Alyn
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Hi Michael,
I see where you are coming from. These stamps are so unusual that they push the limits on traditional philatelic terminology.
Generally speaking, accepting what a fake, counterfeit, or cinderella etc. have been defined to be in the foreword of the catalog, perhaps serves everybody best in the vast majority of instances. Similarly, I don't think redefining the traditional dichotomy of used (postally used, right column) vs. unused (not, left column) in the Scott catalog just because of the existence of one stamp-record set from Bhutan is necessary. Scott does an excellent job charting the different subcategories of unused, ranging from MNH to no gum. Based on these categories, "played on a record player" will only move the needle on the unused categorization if it disturbs the gum.
Having said that, there are philatelic items that have their own categorizations. I think this is your point. For instance, booklets are often valued in MNH "unexploded" condition, and so noted in the catalog. So, perhaps there is a premium for this set for MNH "unplayed" condition. This, of course assumes that playing would even leave a trace.
In any event, this is a great acquisition. Very cool. Obviously, entirely philatelic, but a great set. Congratulations.
Arno
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Thanks, Arno.
I see I didn't answer a question about the gum. On the back of each record stamp, there is a gummed paper backing. The paper backing is also a little thicker than normal to act as a stiffener for the records. You wouldn't be able to put a stylus on the record and play it if the records were flimsy.
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This is a pilfered photo of a set from Bhutan that I finally could not resist getting:
I have wanted this set for a long time.
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Auctions - Approvals
re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
How are the songs?
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06:44:31am
re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
How would you play these?
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re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
First, I wouldn't play them. They wouldn't be "mint" anymore.
They do play at 33 1/3 RPM on any record player. If you remember the stamp collecting video done by Gary Burghoff many years ago, he played one of them on a record player in the video.
They are not just songs. They also include narration about Bhutan and its people.
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07:25:20am
re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
How fantastic.. That is a new one on me. Never heard of those before. We're they ever used as actual affixed postage? I assume to make them a postage stamp there was some kind of gum on one side ? I thought my volcanic ash stamps were odd and cool... Might have to track these down.
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this post
Auctions - Approvals
re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
I just read that many / most turntables are not able to play these because the swing of the tone arm is not long enough to complete the record.
I found a few samples of what is on these record stamps as well.
This one is a rather boring narration about Bhutan: http://mp3archives.wfmu.org/archive/FL/bhut1.mp3
And this is a little song: http://mp3archives.wfmu.org/archive/FL/bhut2.mp3
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re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
Jere - Bhutan has been a leader in "different" style stamps. However, the record stamps are quite popular and cat at $400. However, you should be able to find them in the $100 to $200 range. They aren't cheap. They also have issued several CD Rom stamps. Those play on computer CD drives.
I used to have a link to the official Bhutan site where you could watch the videos from the Bhutan CD Rom stamps. They were very well done, but I have lost the link. I tried finding the links to the CD Rom and the records. Thanks, Jan for finding the record links.
It is true that the records are on the small size, and players with the auto-reject will not play them correctly. You would have to find a manual turntable to try to play them. If you do, the central hole of the records may be affected by the spindle (remove the spindle if you can before playing) and/or you could scratch the record with the needle. Either way the stamps may not be considered MNH any more if that happens.
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re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
Perhaps splitting hair, but does the distinction of mint vs. used not relate to the use of a stamp for postage? "Playing" the stamp on a record player, therefore, does not constitute using it (philatelically speaking that is)? So, even if played, it is still mint, albeit if playing damages the back -- which we don't know if that would happen -- , the stamp may then be considered mint disturbed gum. MNH does not mean "untouched by human hands." It just means anything touching the back did not leave any visible marks. So, as long as playing leaves no trace, I would still consider the stamps 'MNH.'
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re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
I disagree with your definition.
To me:
Mint = in the condition as if the stamp just left the post office (post office fresh with no damage; never hinged is presumed).
Unused = not used, original gum but no longer "post office fresh" (may include damage in the unused state and can be NH, but it is no longer mint)
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22 Nov 2013
08:04:22am
re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
I am with Arno on this one I think philatelically, playing one of these on a record player, cd player or on your computer wouldn't move it into unused.
Alyn
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re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
Hi Michael,
I see where you are coming from. These stamps are so unusual that they push the limits on traditional philatelic terminology.
Generally speaking, accepting what a fake, counterfeit, or cinderella etc. have been defined to be in the foreword of the catalog, perhaps serves everybody best in the vast majority of instances. Similarly, I don't think redefining the traditional dichotomy of used (postally used, right column) vs. unused (not, left column) in the Scott catalog just because of the existence of one stamp-record set from Bhutan is necessary. Scott does an excellent job charting the different subcategories of unused, ranging from MNH to no gum. Based on these categories, "played on a record player" will only move the needle on the unused categorization if it disturbs the gum.
Having said that, there are philatelic items that have their own categorizations. I think this is your point. For instance, booklets are often valued in MNH "unexploded" condition, and so noted in the catalog. So, perhaps there is a premium for this set for MNH "unplayed" condition. This, of course assumes that playing would even leave a trace.
In any event, this is a great acquisition. Very cool. Obviously, entirely philatelic, but a great set. Congratulations.
Arno
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re: New Acquisition - Bhutan
Thanks, Arno.
I see I didn't answer a question about the gum. On the back of each record stamp, there is a gummed paper backing. The paper backing is also a little thicker than normal to act as a stiffener for the records. You wouldn't be able to put a stylus on the record and play it if the records were flimsy.
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