Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Stan
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According to the back of mount packages, measure the stamps themselves and add 5mm to the height and you have the correct size.
Mike
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Stan, have fun..i collect Netherlands East Indies and the numeral and "small circle cancels" of the Netherlands as they come along. Sorry i can not help with the mount sizes, i use vario plastic stock pages.
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Hi Stan,
I also collect these numeral cancels. Just be aware that completion is probably impossible as some numbers are very rare.
The mounts I use are open topped mounts that are 30 mm high by 25 mm wide. I believe that the stamps themselves are 26 mm high by 21 mm wide.
Jan
1 Member
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Hi Simothecat thanks for the information regarding the stamp mounts needed. These are the numerals I am missing from my collection;
137
139
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
155
159
220
221
222
226
230
232
233
244
246
248
251
252
253
254
255
256
257
258
259
Would be interested in purchasing the non expensive ones that I am missing.
One more question I have is that I am rather confused when it comes to some of the Netherlands Numeral Cancels especially the number 68 on stamps if you hold the stamp one way it looks like the number 89 how can you tell whether the number on the Netherland Numeral Cancel is 68 or 89?
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I would imagine that the examples you have of cancels containing the numeral 8 should give you a clue. The top loop should be smaller than the bottom, which should then enable you to orientate the cancel correctly:
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That would be Arnhem..a well known place.
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Yes, that's correct. 1 to 135 are the major cities in alphabetic order. After that it is additions whenever a postoffice was opened. See my webpage. I cannot give you any rarity values for the various numbers though.
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Hi Stan,
Your collection is clearly more advanced than mine. I still currently miss just over 100 numbers. The ones you miss are the more expensive values. I read an article once, that claimed that there are only 5 known copies of 259 (many forgeries though). This is not too surprizing though, as that postoffice opened 1 June, and then stopped using the 259 on 15 June 1893. A genuine one will cost you $$$$ if not $$$$$.
Telling the difference between a 6 and a 9 is difficult but can be done. One of my catalogues shows photographs, but I found that they didn't help much.
Jan
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If there could be a doubt about the cancel being a 6 or 9, for instance with numbers 6, 9, 69, 66, 99, an extra point was added. So it became 6. or 9. or 9.9 or 6.6 Apart from that, there is a difference in shape between the 6 and the 9. The "hook" of the 6 is more open.
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Hi Simothecat:
Jan thank you for responses to my inquiry, what part of Holland if you are indeed in Holland are you from I was born in Leiden but now live in Ottawa, Canada.
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I live in Schagen, Noord-Holland, but originally from the former island Wieringen, just a few kms more to the north (near the "Afsluitdijk").
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I now live in Vancouver, but was born in the Hague.
The other Jan.
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My wife is from Laren N.H. no one in the family can afford to live there !
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Yes, Laren is one of the richest places in the country. Lot of old money over there but also many nouveaux riches... In one word: posh.
To compare, the mean price of houses over there is 3 times of what it is where I live. And that's an average. Most houses cost even more...
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Hello everyone thank you very much for all the responses I have received. I have one more question and that is I read somewhere that the Dutch post card (Brief Kart) could not have numeral cancellations on it but the one I have has 3 postage dues on it with the numeral 5.
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Hi Stan,
I just checked "de poststempels van nederland 1676 - 1915" by O.M. Vellinga.
He states that the number cancel was not authorized for use to cancel postcards with a pre-printed stamp (a postal card). He then gives a list of 22 offices where this was done (at some time or other) against regulations.
The number cancel was to be used on a post card with a stamp attached, and also on postage due stamps (including on postcards).
Jan
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Here is a list of known number cancels on postcards (which is from a different source and contains 25 different numbers instead of 22). Placed "by mistake or for other reasons".
No.4. Amersfoort.
No 5. Amsterdam.
No 16. Breda.
No 20. Culenborg.
No 34. Elburg.
No 44. ’s-Gravenhage.
No 45. Groningen.
No 46. Haarlem.
No 51. Heerenveen.
No 57. ’s-Hertogenbosch.
No 62. Hoorn.
No 67. Leeuwarden.
No 69. De Lemmer.
No.82. Nijmegen.
No 87. Oudenbosch.
No 91. Rotterdam.
No 99. Sneek.
No 112. Velp.
No 118. Wageningen.
No 120. Weesp.
No 130. Zevenaar.
No 136. Spoorwegpostkantoor no. 1.
No 137. Spoorwegpostkantoor no. 4.
No 138. Spoorwegpostkantoor no. 2.
No 153. Oss.
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And for completeness, here is a scan showing the difference between the 6 and the 9:
(Images from "Catalogus der Puntstempels van Nederland" by H. Koopman (1968 edition)). The 6 seems to have more white space between the curl and the oval.
Jan
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Hi Simothecat thank you once again for your response. I am now retired and living on a fixed income but would like to know how much the book you have on Netherland Numeral Cancels is in English and what is the cost?
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Great topic ! But i can forget about the $$$$ and the $$$$$ ones .
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Stan,
My catalogues are long out of print. The most recent catalogue is part of "Specialiteiten Catalogus, 2006-2011", but I do not have one of these, so I can't tell you about it. Some booksellers may still have copies of it.
Jan
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Phil,
But the thtill is in the hunt. Who knows, maybe one of us will strike it lucky on of these days.
Jan
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This is a great exercise for me...here are the ones i can positively ID. i will put an asterisk by the ones i have a duplicate of. #2,5,16,22,30,33,42,57* 67,68,75,76,84,91,94,99* 106* 107,113,115,133 and 166. There are some i dare not try to id for reasons you guys know about...poor printing of the numerals,heavy cancel which make.. ones and fours questionable, or the number too close to the edge where possibly a number is missing. I have hundreds of the Netherlands Indies King and young Queen types but not ONE numeral cancel among them.
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Stan, I used to collect these years ago. I still have some of the ones you need, the best one being Middelharnis, 257. If interested, please let me know and I will send you a list of the ones I can help you with.
Peter
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Hi petert4522 I would be interested to see which of the Netherlands Numeral Cancels you have and at what price you are selling them at?
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Stan, I have four numbers that are on your list. I have King William 5 cent with #220, 232 and 248. I have number 257 on the Queen 5 cent.
I don't have # 259, sorry!
If you send me your address via my E-mail I will mail them to you. From one retiree to another!
Peter
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Hi peter4522 thank you very much this is my email address:
sbeerenfeng@rogers.com
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Hello could any of the collectors give me the name of dealers that handle or sell Netherlands numeral cancels?
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Stan, try this: www.postzegelwinkel-amsterdam.nl .
He claims to have the largest inventory of puntstempels in the world!
In the Netherlads a numeral cancel is called a 'puntstempel' , literally translated a dotcancel! After all, the dots are what is different from a regular cancel!
Peter
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09:17:31am
Hi I have a collection of the Netherland Numeral cancellations but would like to mount them in pre cut stamp mounts could anyone tell me in mm what size of pre cut stamp mounts I need for the King William stamps and the young Wilhelmina stamps etc.
Stan
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re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
According to the back of mount packages, measure the stamps themselves and add 5mm to the height and you have the correct size.
Mike
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this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Stan, have fun..i collect Netherlands East Indies and the numeral and "small circle cancels" of the Netherlands as they come along. Sorry i can not help with the mount sizes, i use vario plastic stock pages.
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11:02:03am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi Stan,
I also collect these numeral cancels. Just be aware that completion is probably impossible as some numbers are very rare.
The mounts I use are open topped mounts that are 30 mm high by 25 mm wide. I believe that the stamps themselves are 26 mm high by 21 mm wide.
Jan
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
01:45:01pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi Simothecat thanks for the information regarding the stamp mounts needed. These are the numerals I am missing from my collection;
137
139
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
155
159
220
221
222
226
230
232
233
244
246
248
251
252
253
254
255
256
257
258
259
Would be interested in purchasing the non expensive ones that I am missing.
One more question I have is that I am rather confused when it comes to some of the Netherlands Numeral Cancels especially the number 68 on stamps if you hold the stamp one way it looks like the number 89 how can you tell whether the number on the Netherland Numeral Cancel is 68 or 89?
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
I would imagine that the examples you have of cancels containing the numeral 8 should give you a clue. The top loop should be smaller than the bottom, which should then enable you to orientate the cancel correctly:
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
That would be Arnhem..a well known place.
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Yes, that's correct. 1 to 135 are the major cities in alphabetic order. After that it is additions whenever a postoffice was opened. See my webpage. I cannot give you any rarity values for the various numbers though.
Login to Like
this post
07:32:41pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi Stan,
Your collection is clearly more advanced than mine. I still currently miss just over 100 numbers. The ones you miss are the more expensive values. I read an article once, that claimed that there are only 5 known copies of 259 (many forgeries though). This is not too surprizing though, as that postoffice opened 1 June, and then stopped using the 259 on 15 June 1893. A genuine one will cost you $$$$ if not $$$$$.
Telling the difference between a 6 and a 9 is difficult but can be done. One of my catalogues shows photographs, but I found that they didn't help much.
Jan
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
If there could be a doubt about the cancel being a 6 or 9, for instance with numbers 6, 9, 69, 66, 99, an extra point was added. So it became 6. or 9. or 9.9 or 6.6 Apart from that, there is a difference in shape between the 6 and the 9. The "hook" of the 6 is more open.
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08:02:42am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi Simothecat:
Jan thank you for responses to my inquiry, what part of Holland if you are indeed in Holland are you from I was born in Leiden but now live in Ottawa, Canada.
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
I live in Schagen, Noord-Holland, but originally from the former island Wieringen, just a few kms more to the north (near the "Afsluitdijk").
1 Member
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01:08:25pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
I now live in Vancouver, but was born in the Hague.
The other Jan.
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this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
My wife is from Laren N.H. no one in the family can afford to live there !
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Yes, Laren is one of the richest places in the country. Lot of old money over there but also many nouveaux riches... In one word: posh.
To compare, the mean price of houses over there is 3 times of what it is where I live. And that's an average. Most houses cost even more...
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this post
03:40:38pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hello everyone thank you very much for all the responses I have received. I have one more question and that is I read somewhere that the Dutch post card (Brief Kart) could not have numeral cancellations on it but the one I have has 3 postage dues on it with the numeral 5.
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this post
07:53:22pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi Stan,
I just checked "de poststempels van nederland 1676 - 1915" by O.M. Vellinga.
He states that the number cancel was not authorized for use to cancel postcards with a pre-printed stamp (a postal card). He then gives a list of 22 offices where this was done (at some time or other) against regulations.
The number cancel was to be used on a post card with a stamp attached, and also on postage due stamps (including on postcards).
Jan
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Here is a list of known number cancels on postcards (which is from a different source and contains 25 different numbers instead of 22). Placed "by mistake or for other reasons".
No.4. Amersfoort.
No 5. Amsterdam.
No 16. Breda.
No 20. Culenborg.
No 34. Elburg.
No 44. ’s-Gravenhage.
No 45. Groningen.
No 46. Haarlem.
No 51. Heerenveen.
No 57. ’s-Hertogenbosch.
No 62. Hoorn.
No 67. Leeuwarden.
No 69. De Lemmer.
No.82. Nijmegen.
No 87. Oudenbosch.
No 91. Rotterdam.
No 99. Sneek.
No 112. Velp.
No 118. Wageningen.
No 120. Weesp.
No 130. Zevenaar.
No 136. Spoorwegpostkantoor no. 1.
No 137. Spoorwegpostkantoor no. 4.
No 138. Spoorwegpostkantoor no. 2.
No 153. Oss.
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11:33:56pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
And for completeness, here is a scan showing the difference between the 6 and the 9:
(Images from "Catalogus der Puntstempels van Nederland" by H. Koopman (1968 edition)). The 6 seems to have more white space between the curl and the oval.
Jan
1 Member
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Login to Like.
06:37:28am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi Simothecat thank you once again for your response. I am now retired and living on a fixed income but would like to know how much the book you have on Netherland Numeral Cancels is in English and what is the cost?
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Great topic ! But i can forget about the $$$$ and the $$$$$ ones .
Login to Like
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03:00:35pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Stan,
My catalogues are long out of print. The most recent catalogue is part of "Specialiteiten Catalogus, 2006-2011", but I do not have one of these, so I can't tell you about it. Some booksellers may still have copies of it.
Jan
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this post
03:01:59pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Phil,
But the thtill is in the hunt. Who knows, maybe one of us will strike it lucky on of these days.
Jan
Login to Like
this post
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
This is a great exercise for me...here are the ones i can positively ID. i will put an asterisk by the ones i have a duplicate of. #2,5,16,22,30,33,42,57* 67,68,75,76,84,91,94,99* 106* 107,113,115,133 and 166. There are some i dare not try to id for reasons you guys know about...poor printing of the numerals,heavy cancel which make.. ones and fours questionable, or the number too close to the edge where possibly a number is missing. I have hundreds of the Netherlands Indies King and young Queen types but not ONE numeral cancel among them.
Login to Like
this post
04:47:02pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Stan, I used to collect these years ago. I still have some of the ones you need, the best one being Middelharnis, 257. If interested, please let me know and I will send you a list of the ones I can help you with.
Peter
1 Member
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08:34:33am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi petert4522 I would be interested to see which of the Netherlands Numeral Cancels you have and at what price you are selling them at?
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10:35:36am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Stan, I have four numbers that are on your list. I have King William 5 cent with #220, 232 and 248. I have number 257 on the Queen 5 cent.
I don't have # 259, sorry!
If you send me your address via my E-mail I will mail them to you. From one retiree to another!
Peter
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10:45:12am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hi peter4522 thank you very much this is my email address:
sbeerenfeng@rogers.com
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08:03:40am
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Hello could any of the collectors give me the name of dealers that handle or sell Netherlands numeral cancels?
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01:39:57pm
re: Netherland Numeral Cancellations
Stan, try this: www.postzegelwinkel-amsterdam.nl .
He claims to have the largest inventory of puntstempels in the world!
In the Netherlads a numeral cancel is called a 'puntstempel' , literally translated a dotcancel! After all, the dots are what is different from a regular cancel!
Peter
1 Member
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