Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I've never had anything remotely like this with a new neighbor. My wife says it's a generation thing. Millennials just don't give a damn about norms. She says they probably view us as a pair of old nitwits, or something. Lots to look forward to with these people..
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My sympathies for you. We have dealt with our neighbor's barking, roaming dogs for 26 years now, and these neighbors are now in their early 80s! Don't think it is just the millennials...
What really gets me are the people out walking their dogs in public places (parks, walking trails) without leashes. They always say "It's OK", like their dog won't hurt anyone, and it's just fine to ignore leash laws.
My husband and I hiked the New Jersey section of the Appalachian trail last fall with two friends from Texas. One was severely mauled by her neighbor's two dogs about 4 weeks prior to our trip. She survived and was able to recover enough to hike short sections but we encountered several people walking their dogs without leashes who wouldn't even call their dogs back. We had to form a protective barrier around her (I think I would be afraid too after going through something like that). These people were all ages. No one was abusive towards us but they just don't think.
Hope you are able to make peace with your neighbors before things get worse.
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Seems like a strange way for a newcomer to behave..the world is changed in 50 years..when we moved in everyone had kids..so we knew everyone...the women would share rides to Doctors appointments and such while we guys were at work. The thing i notice is that they are not interested in their neighbors nowadays..i guess everyone is self sufficient..I guess the days are gone when you got a good feeling by being of use to a neighbor.
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I agree with Sally, I do not think it is a generational issue. In fact, I think a case could be made that if any generation has lower social boundaries it is those 55+ years old. (I know for sure that is true for me.) In a recent poll, millennials reported a high level of stress over not getting enough ‘Likes’ on social media posts; that hardly sounds like a group who does not care about what others think.
Here is my neighbor story… For a number of years I drove my wife to her store each day; the trip took us through a nice older neighborhood of two story Victorian houses. One house in particular always drew our attention, it was meticulously well kept, beautifully detailed with its painted intricate trim. Right next door to it was the biggest dump you have ever seen. A run-down house in with crap in the bushes, garage all over the lawn, wreaked cars in the driveway. My wife and I always remarked, ‘those poor bastards in that beautiful Victorian have to live next door to these inconsiderate clods’. Over a period of about 5 years, the ‘dump house’ got worse and worse.
Then one day the house next to ours went up for sale. Son-of-gun if the people who lived in the ‘dump house’ moved next to us!!! Within 4 months they trashed the house. They had 8 kids all of whom were out-of-control; my wife looked out the window one day and one of the teen boys was urinating in our yard. I tried to talk to their mother, whose name was Destiny, but she was loopy and semi-coherent.
So call it God, Karma, fate, apparently they were there to teach me a lesson. Lesson learned, I do not point out ’bad’ houses anymore. LOL
Don
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Some people always seem to have a gripe, complaint, struggle or issue with others whether it be with the local copy store, an online stamp dealer, the USPS or a neighbor. I've found that if you just set about life's path treating everyone with respect the karma comes back in kind. You kind of tipped your hand when you said, "shes a little twit".
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"millennials reported a high level of stress over not getting enough ‘Likes’ on social media"
I think you have to go beyond the survey question as to why are they stressed. Is it because they care about others, or is it all about themselves and their status/bragging rights of how many more "likes" they can receive over other people?
I get laughed at when asked how many "friends" I have on Facebook, and I answer,"6". After getting laughed at, I get told that they have "hundreds", and they laugh again. I think it's pitiful to live your life for a number tallied on a computer, rather than actually having fiends who are real people. But, that's the world as it is today, instantaneous satisfaction over the huge number of friends that people have on social media, but actually the term has little to do with the definition provided in the dictionary, or in life.
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Millenials have their issues, there is no question about that but I have to speak up for them a bit regarding facebook and other social media. Back when I was in high school, if you and a few buddies got together on a Saturday that was a great day. My son is a high school senior and they routinely "get the word out" on social media and get 100-150 kids from 3 different high schools to show up at the beach. Looks like they're all having a good time. He shows me the pictures! 
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Ernie,your earlier post was a grocery list of things I'd posted about on here recently.
I'll forgive you misjudging me since you don't get to see what a friendly nice person I can be, usually.
That's a joke. 
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Getting "friends" on facebook is a totally meaningless statistic. When I spent some time playing facebook games a few years ago I had a few thousand. But they aren't friends - its mostly just other gamers who by the nature of facebook games you require to link to in order to advance the games. Mostly they aren't even real accounts. You would make a separate account just for gaming so all these basically anonymous folks didn't clutter up any real page you had with endless accomplishment posts and the like. In my opinion facebook is one of the most useless things on the internet. Just a lot of endlessly recycled posts and videos akin to what used to be trivia/humor columns in the newspapers. There are some genuine uses for it but the vast bulk of what goes on is utterly mindless.
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I am not one to defend millennials too much, but I do think they are far more technically savvy then our generation. Millennials figured out years ago that Facebook was selling their personal information; so they avoid using it and consider it a ‘old fart’ platform. So when people mention ‘millennials and social media’ they typically mean social media platforms like Snapchat, Instagram and Twitter.
The Facebook demographic is much older people who still do not understand that Facebook is treating them as the product. They believe that if they are not getting spam email, then no one is selling their personal information. But the truth is that having a Facebook account is like allowing them to place a big sandwich board over your head.
Don
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Yo, Snick... it's all good my brother. I hope you find a way to turn it around with your new neighbors. Animosity between neighbors is a very stressful situation. Leave a six pack of Coca Cola Classic with a bow on with a card that says "welcome to the neighborhood! Please let us know if we can be helpful to you in anyway." Have a great week!
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As an "old fart" I don't use Faecesbook or Witter or any other anti-social media.
Maybe I am not an "old fart" but a DINOSAUR!!
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Some people, any age, are like that.
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As an "old fart" I don't use Faecesbook or Witter or any other anti-social media.
Nice play on words there Ian. Just about sums up some of the crap that passes for posts on these social networks.
Our grandaughters mother has some 5-600 "friends" but seems never to have anyone else, other than us, to mind the child while she works or goes out. Not that we complain but it's a 45 minute trip each way at our expense and no fun in winter blizzards.
As far as the original post goes, just ignore the new neighbours or come to accept that the F word is now thrown into daily conversation almost every third word. It merely shows a lack of command of basic language skills. Sadly not corrected sufficiently in the current education curriculum.
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I was a high school teacher for 34 years and retired 4 years ago. I saw generations come and go and each one seemed a bit worse to me - ruder and with less respect. So get used to this sort of thing since it will get more common. Almost everyone seems to be in a huge hurry to get from A to B and will do or say almost anything if you get in the way. Of course I'm an old fart now and maybe I just get upset over anything! Good luck!!!
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i agree with Harvey, somewhere along the line many parents (but not all) simply did not bother to teach their kids manners. We were in Europe late November/early December and we were both deeply impressed how quickly people on trains and trams got up and offered their seats to us.
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I feel this thing about "friends" with the younger generations started decades ago. My daughter was more concerned about her "friends" and what they thought or did meant more to her than family back in the eighties.
The problem started as soon as she started secondary school (age 12). There she met all those other kids. You know the ones that could stay up until three in the morning, got £100 per week allowance, had the latest fashions, had every food allergy on the planet, and knew everything about life. Of course us parents knew absolutely nothing about anything and were more like prison wardens.
Of course when she encountered minor problems her so called "friends" were nowhere to be seen or heard from.
She is now a Social Worker. One day she phoned me to say that when she was advising a client she suddenly realised that what she was saying was the exact advice I had given her at one time. " Oh my god I'm turning into my dad " she thought.
There is nothing new in the Universe.
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It seems that every generation believes the next and following are inferior and worsening. Case in point, I hear myself now repeating the exact same words that my grand and great grandparents were saying many, many decades ago about us!
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We have that kind of discussions too with our 15 years old son: But my friends are allowed to... (fill in the blanks). Many times we try reason and patiently explain why it is different with us, but sometimes one gets fed up with it and the reply is cynical: perhaps you should try to get yourself adopted. Not very pedagogical of course and not what we really want, but we never noticed him thinking that it might actually be a good idea either... 
It is hard to get the idea out of his head that it is not a hotel with free cab service. Social media does not help much in that respect.
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Jings! Crivvens! Help Ma Boab!
Are kids today still using "Dads Taxis" ?
I know you want to keep your kids safe and if it means sitting outside some dismal place waiting for the offspring to appear then so be it.
What I did do once was make a couple of "Dads Taxi" signs put them in the car windows while waiting for the "proper little madam" to appear with her "friends". She was NOT pleased, but we had a nice quiet journey home and her drivers duties were somewhat reduced over the next few weeks!!
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I actually think the initial scene is a showcase for how easy it is to speak in ways that make subsequent communication all that more difficult. Two statements: both relatively neutral, but both governed by situations that preceded them.
If it's any consolation, our relationships with neighbors range from anonymity to animosity.
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Maybe she was just trying to proposition you? A prompt response of "No thanks, I am happily married," would be a funny comeback.
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If I said something it would be something like "Oh Really?"
'
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We took a trip last October to London and since I still have a weakened left ankle from a severe sprain two years ago I took a cane with me to help in walking. I was amazed at the level of consideration I got from total strangers, mostly on the tube and buses. Many of those were young people. I couldn't help contrast that with what I see over here. My son living with us is 23 and does not fit the stereotype often applied to his age. We were older parents so maybe that had something to do with it.
So far as the young lady next door is concerned, my referring to her as a 'little twit' may have been in poor taste. She's one of those girls with multi colored hair and wears reflective sunglasses. Nothing wrong with either of those things just a bit jarring to me and the potty mouth sort of adds to the charm.
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12:29:20pm
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Perfect, Roy.
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The rudeness, contempt for everything and everyone, the lack of morality starts in the highest office in your country. I'm sure the next generation is paying attention to the new norm.
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CF, I'll disagree with you. The rudeness, contempt and lack of morality does not start in the highest office, it starts in the home. To quote one of your countrymen:
"In a democracy, the people get the government they deserve." Alexis De Tocqueville
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"Many young people were so pampered nowadays that they had forgotten that there was such a thing as walking, and they made automatically for the buses… unless they did something, the future for walking was very poor indeed. 1951- Falkirk Herald"
"It’s an irony, but so many of us are a cautious, nervous, conservative crew that some of the elders who five years ago feared that we might come trooping home full of foreign radical ideas are now afraid that the opposite might be too true, and that we could be lacking some of the old American gambling spirit and enterprise.” 1950 - Life"
"Parents themselves were often the cause of many difficulties. They frequently failed in their obvious duty to teach self-control and discipline to their own children.” 1938 - Leeds Mercury"
"We defy anyone who goes about with his eyes open to deny that there is, as never before, an attitude on the part of young folk which is best described as grossly thoughtless, rude, and utterly selfish.” 1925 Daily Mail"
"Whither are the manly vigour and athletic appearance of our forefathers flown? Can these be their legitimate heirs? Surely, no; a race of effeminate, self-admiring, emaciated fribbles can never have descended in a direct line from the heroes of Potiers and Agincourt... 1771 - Town and Country "
Don
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"The rudeness, contempt for everything and everyone, the lack of morality starts in the highest office in your country."
CF, such a comment is arrogant, self-serving and false. The topic being discussed is found all over the world, and has been growing for a long time. There was no need to make a self-serving political comment. I'm sure there are plenty of examples of similar behavior by plenty of politicians in Europe and elsewhere. So knock off the political commentary with the false narrative and attacks against another country, which is rude and shows disrespect and contempt for members here. I know it makes some people feel superior, but in reality it makes the one who posts such drivel look ignorant.
A reminder that political commentary is not permitted in the Discussion Board.
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'
Starting when we are very little, we see the world around us, and we draw conclusions about the world around us: what a mommy-and-daddy look like, what colors of people do what sorts of jobs, who defers to whom, etc.
When exceptions arise - because the people around us (or, more to the point, the people coming after us) are doing things differently - it strikes us at a level well below conscious thought & learned values, eg, "that just ain't right".
Sometimes, these differences are soon understood to be frivolous, eg, the Beatles look like girls.
Sometimes, they might take some getting used to, eg, those guys are holding hands.
But the mathematics are simple:
1) NextGen makes a batch of changes.
2) Some of these challenge conclusions we formed when we were very, very young.
3) NextGen is going to hell.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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Don, the quotes that you posted reminded me of things going back to the 1800s in the philatelic press that I read that predicted the demise of stamp collecting.
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Anecdotal evidence serves to prove little, alas, and only bolsters personal opinion. So I'll do a little bolstering here, with a trio of incidents.
Yesterday, following a family out of our corner shop, their young son (he'd be about 9 years old) made sure to hold the door open for me as I passed through. His family had walked on to the car-park, so he wasn't doing it to impress them. Now where did he learn that? (I had half a mind to catch up with the parents and congratulate them on their son's behaviour, but we tend not to go quite that far in England.)
Behaviour on the London Underground is variable. The visibly struggling older or pregnant person is usually offered a seat, but journeys can be long and uncomfortably crowded, and I confess I have not always given up a cherished seat when probably I should have done. Visiting St Petersburg a fortnight ago, however, I noticed things were different. In that city, men routinely stand for any female traveller, though with none of the little invitational gestures we in England feel necessary to accompany our good manners. True, their metro is not as extensive as London's, and probably not always as crowded, but it is a pleasing custom that cannot be dismissed with easy quips about state-regulated societies and suchlike.
A dozen or so years ago, I walked into a London stamp shop owned by a well-known (I think) gentleman, who wanted to know what I was looking for. As I was looking for nothing in particular, but enjoyed browsing in stamp shops (when they existed!) I answered accordingly. His response was to utter a few choice words and show me the door. The next time I passed that way (Covent Garden, since you ask) his shop no longer existed. I'm sure he retired a wealthy man, and much-respected in philatelic circles. Though not by me.
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While in London a few months back I dropped into the Gibbons shop on the Strand. I wasn't sure what to expect but I was treated very well. I only bought a Concise catalog but was made to feel welcome. I even got to go upstairs and get a glimpse of their auction department.
Guthrum I think I know who you refer to. If I'm right he had a reputation for that sort of thing. He still posts sometimes on another board based 'Down Under'.
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You can see people's attitudes are different in different areas. In the New York / New Jersey metro area, drivers are pretty aggressive and you are involved in a game of chicken to get into another lane. Forget anyone letting you out into the lane from a parking lot!
I went to Denver many years ago and stayed at a hotel that was right next to the Interstate. Every time we exited the hotel, the traffic was backed up with people waiting to enter the Interstate. The first time, my thought was that we'd never get out of the lot. But each and every time, the very first person who could give us a break cheerfully waved us in front of them! Quite a culture shock!
Also when we moved to the Pennsylvania suburbs west of Philadelphia we noticed that people were nicer. People regularly hold doors open for you at stores, and generally are better mannered than in our previous metro area.
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You should be careful when discussing good ( or otherwise ) manners. It is often a case of cultural norms.
As an example, many years ago I worked in the Scout Association hostel in London. Now at the time the UK norm was to say "please and thank you" to anything. We had a party of American Scouts who didn't seem to use the words at all. However after a couple of days we noticed that "I want" was usually prefixed by "Sir". This indicated that respect was enunciated somewhat differently, but should be considered equally valid.
As for the opening of doors, I was brought up to always hold the door for a female ( of any age ). Nowadays to do so is sometimes to invite a stream of abuse.
Some of the more strident females appear to be unable to differentiate between equality and courtesy. It is possible to believe in gender equality ( as I do ) without compromising chivalry and good manners.
In one of our classrooms at school was the inscription "Manners Maketh Man"......well it was an all boys school.
Malcolm
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Last week, a teenager turned down the wrong way on a one way street. Of course I was the car going the correct way, and with a one lane road he was upset that I was blocking his way. I told him it was a one way street. He told me to "relax". He said it wasn't that big of a deal. Maybe not that time, but one day/night, he'll do the same thing and get into a head-on collision.
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I am probably going to get crapped on for what I'm about to say, but what the heck! I'm in my 60s and when I was growing up in Canada ( Nova Scotia ) all of the kids I knew had a parent at home during the day and had meals as a family. I think respect was taught at home and there was always a parent around if we screwed up. I was in a single parent home so I was a bid different, my father died when I was very young. I don't remember anyone ever getting divorced, in other words society was very different then. I'm not saying it was better or worse, just different. We both respected and feared many adults we knew - again, different now. Respect now has to be earned and that is often not easy. We cannot expect to get respect from people just because we are older. Major changes in society have changed the way younger people react to us and we have to get used to that - it's not going to change!!! As an ex-teacher, I was sworn at and abused in many ways. And I was a coach for several teams and helped out with social events - God knows how teachers were treated who didn't help the kids out!
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We wouldn't dare yell at or abuse a teacher or coach. We would get kicked out of school or off the team. Then, there would be our parents to get prepared for when we got home. Most likely we wouldn't have been able to sit properly for a month after that. If we got bad grades, it wasn't the teacher's fault, it was ours. My parents would never have gone racing up to the school to accuse the teacher if intentionally giving us bad grades and ruining our chances for a college scholarship, then bringing a lawyer down on the school.
We also would never call non-related adults by their first names. It was always sir, mam, mr., mrs., or miss. Now, informality is the norm.
I have been a sports coach, and the children learned from their parents to disrespect the coaches. In the little league team I coached, the parents demanded that the team be made Little League World Series ready. The boys on the team were no where close to being any sort of a championship team, but it was my fault that they weren't, not the lack of talent on the part of the children.
I am a certified USA Junior Olympics coach for bowling. Several of the children who I coached went on to win major bowling tournaments on the state and national level. Some children that I helped coach went on to international victories. Still, several parents wouldn't let us instruct their children in how to bowl correctly. They want to teach the children, because they were league bowlers and knew how to bowl a certain way that they wanted their children to learn. There really is only one way to bowl correctly, and league bowling with a belly full of beer isn't it.
I have watched the parents as they threw gutter ball after gutter ball "teaching" their children how to bowl. Arrogance, narcissism and selfishness are in control now. Manners and respect do not exist.
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Thanks Michael I coached high school boys baseball and softball. Except for smoking and chewing tobacco in the dugouts when we weren't watching, plus a bit of occasional swearing the kids weren't anywhere near as much of a problem as some of the parents. Since it was a high school team I tried as much as possible to let all of the kids to get a chance to play. A couple times we made the provincial championships and them we had to change things a little bit. The kids wanted a chance to win so some kids played a bit more than others. The kids "got it" but the parents didn't. There were several times that parents started yelling at me because their "little Johnny" didn't get enough field time, sometimes cursing and swearing at me to the point where the umps had to intervene. It's easy to see why kids are losing their respect for authority when the parents show that kind of example. I haven't coached for a while now so I guess it is probably worse.
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Before I retired from teaching in 1990, every member of my high school’s basketball team was caught drinking on a school trip, in direct contravention of the team’s (and the school district’s) rules. In a highly principled decision, our principal, Doug Hallman, told the team members that they were no longer welcome at Prince George (BC) Secondary School and would have to enrol at other area high schools.
In my opinion, that was exactly the right response, but the father of one of the boys disagreed. He argued that his son needed a course that was only offered at PGSS. The school board, elected officials all, agreed with the father and forced Doug to allow the boy to continue attending PGSS. I’m sure that father believes he did the right thing.
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I am always thankful when a person is polite. I am not thankful when a person is rude.
Bruce
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It seems the "New Norm" is to find something or someone to transfer your lacks and failures on.
"Owning It" is often quoted but seldom practiced.
Imagine how little time it took to get to this stage and where it might go from here......
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"Imagine how little time it took to get to this stage and where it might go from here......"
Amen.
Tad
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It's interesting the decline of civilization!
The other day I was driving home to PA from NJ and put on NJ talk radio for the traffic reports. The topic was a published list of the friendliest states.
The two talk show hosts were upset that New Jersey was near the bottom of the list as number 46. Callers then blamed it on the influx of New Yorkers, since NY was the least friendliest state according to the survey.
Pennsylvania was the 18th friendliest state. And a funny thing, we noticed it when we moved here. People would say hello in stores and hold doors open for you. Then we assimilated into the culture and now take it for granted.
A few weeks ago we stayed a week in NJ at my daughters. I went to Wegman's grocery store and noticed how unfriendly everyone was. People didn't say hello, excuse me or any contact they could avoid. They'd look the other way when they passed you in the aisles, or downright glare at you for being in their way. We never noticed that when we lived there!
Today I went to the local Giant supermarket. Yes, Pennsylvania is friendly! People would smile and say hello as you passed them in the aisles. I think I will stay here!
And here's that survey: https://bigseventravel.com/2019/08/the-50-friendliest-states-in-america/
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I wonder where they got the data.
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All these emails remind me of a previous conversation about the state of youth, manners and the overall decline of cilization I had in another lifetime with Plato or was it Aristotle?
Bruce
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It was with me when I was Socrates or Pliny the Elder.
I've just remembered. It was when I was Achilles!!
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#4! What can I say? We'll just have to work a little harder on it to get back up to #1!
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Florida is ranked 42. I think south Florida skews the survey. North of Orlando is like a different state. I can totally see Texas being high on the list. I'm out there for work all the time and the people are noticeably friendly and hospitable. I love Texas.
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Something I’ve noticed since moving to Vancouver and using the city’s excellent transit system: many bus passengers thank the bus driver as they exit the bus. Does that happen in other cities?
Bob
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'
After a few days of driving & errands in Pennsylvania, my grandson & I both remarked on how friendly & open everyone was ... compared to NYC.
New Yorkers thank the bus drivers, hold open doors, etc, under the name of common courtesy ... but that is very different from getting to know the person sitting next to you on the bus. Ever.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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A young couple, probably both under 25 bought the house next door to us this month. My wife and I are retired, we have one adult son living with us. We pretty much keep to ourselves. It is nice however to be on speaking terms with people living in close proximity. My wife had a brief hello sort of brief talk with the guy three weeks ago. The girl just seems to be a little twit. They have two annoying little dogs that yap endlessly. Yesterday morning I was out walking and ran into her walking them. I'd heard them snarling as she walked toward me so I stepped around her to give her more room with them. She snapped 'Ignore them, you don't need to do that'. I smiled and said it'd be a little hard to ignore them, I think I said it in a friendly tone. As she passed she said 'F'you.
I've never had anything remotely like this with a new neighbor. My wife says it's a generation thing. Millennials just don't give a damn about norms. She says they probably view us as a pair of old nitwits, or something. Lots to look forward to with these people..
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re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
My sympathies for you. We have dealt with our neighbor's barking, roaming dogs for 26 years now, and these neighbors are now in their early 80s! Don't think it is just the millennials...
What really gets me are the people out walking their dogs in public places (parks, walking trails) without leashes. They always say "It's OK", like their dog won't hurt anyone, and it's just fine to ignore leash laws.
My husband and I hiked the New Jersey section of the Appalachian trail last fall with two friends from Texas. One was severely mauled by her neighbor's two dogs about 4 weeks prior to our trip. She survived and was able to recover enough to hike short sections but we encountered several people walking their dogs without leashes who wouldn't even call their dogs back. We had to form a protective barrier around her (I think I would be afraid too after going through something like that). These people were all ages. No one was abusive towards us but they just don't think.
Hope you are able to make peace with your neighbors before things get worse.
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Auctions
re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
Seems like a strange way for a newcomer to behave..the world is changed in 50 years..when we moved in everyone had kids..so we knew everyone...the women would share rides to Doctors appointments and such while we guys were at work. The thing i notice is that they are not interested in their neighbors nowadays..i guess everyone is self sufficient..I guess the days are gone when you got a good feeling by being of use to a neighbor.
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re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
I agree with Sally, I do not think it is a generational issue. In fact, I think a case could be made that if any generation has lower social boundaries it is those 55+ years old. (I know for sure that is true for me.) In a recent poll, millennials reported a high level of stress over not getting enough ‘Likes’ on social media posts; that hardly sounds like a group who does not care about what others think.
Here is my neighbor story… For a number of years I drove my wife to her store each day; the trip took us through a nice older neighborhood of two story Victorian houses. One house in particular always drew our attention, it was meticulously well kept, beautifully detailed with its painted intricate trim. Right next door to it was the biggest dump you have ever seen. A run-down house in with crap in the bushes, garage all over the lawn, wreaked cars in the driveway. My wife and I always remarked, ‘those poor bastards in that beautiful Victorian have to live next door to these inconsiderate clods’. Over a period of about 5 years, the ‘dump house’ got worse and worse.
Then one day the house next to ours went up for sale. Son-of-gun if the people who lived in the ‘dump house’ moved next to us!!! Within 4 months they trashed the house. They had 8 kids all of whom were out-of-control; my wife looked out the window one day and one of the teen boys was urinating in our yard. I tried to talk to their mother, whose name was Destiny, but she was loopy and semi-coherent.
So call it God, Karma, fate, apparently they were there to teach me a lesson. Lesson learned, I do not point out ’bad’ houses anymore. LOL
Don
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Some people always seem to have a gripe, complaint, struggle or issue with others whether it be with the local copy store, an online stamp dealer, the USPS or a neighbor. I've found that if you just set about life's path treating everyone with respect the karma comes back in kind. You kind of tipped your hand when you said, "shes a little twit".
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"millennials reported a high level of stress over not getting enough ‘Likes’ on social media"
I think you have to go beyond the survey question as to why are they stressed. Is it because they care about others, or is it all about themselves and their status/bragging rights of how many more "likes" they can receive over other people?
I get laughed at when asked how many "friends" I have on Facebook, and I answer,"6". After getting laughed at, I get told that they have "hundreds", and they laugh again. I think it's pitiful to live your life for a number tallied on a computer, rather than actually having fiends who are real people. But, that's the world as it is today, instantaneous satisfaction over the huge number of friends that people have on social media, but actually the term has little to do with the definition provided in the dictionary, or in life.
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Millenials have their issues, there is no question about that but I have to speak up for them a bit regarding facebook and other social media. Back when I was in high school, if you and a few buddies got together on a Saturday that was a great day. My son is a high school senior and they routinely "get the word out" on social media and get 100-150 kids from 3 different high schools to show up at the beach. Looks like they're all having a good time. He shows me the pictures!
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Ernie,your earlier post was a grocery list of things I'd posted about on here recently.
I'll forgive you misjudging me since you don't get to see what a friendly nice person I can be, usually.
That's a joke.
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08:39:38pm
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Getting "friends" on facebook is a totally meaningless statistic. When I spent some time playing facebook games a few years ago I had a few thousand. But they aren't friends - its mostly just other gamers who by the nature of facebook games you require to link to in order to advance the games. Mostly they aren't even real accounts. You would make a separate account just for gaming so all these basically anonymous folks didn't clutter up any real page you had with endless accomplishment posts and the like. In my opinion facebook is one of the most useless things on the internet. Just a lot of endlessly recycled posts and videos akin to what used to be trivia/humor columns in the newspapers. There are some genuine uses for it but the vast bulk of what goes on is utterly mindless.
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I am not one to defend millennials too much, but I do think they are far more technically savvy then our generation. Millennials figured out years ago that Facebook was selling their personal information; so they avoid using it and consider it a ‘old fart’ platform. So when people mention ‘millennials and social media’ they typically mean social media platforms like Snapchat, Instagram and Twitter.
The Facebook demographic is much older people who still do not understand that Facebook is treating them as the product. They believe that if they are not getting spam email, then no one is selling their personal information. But the truth is that having a Facebook account is like allowing them to place a big sandwich board over your head.
Don
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Yo, Snick... it's all good my brother. I hope you find a way to turn it around with your new neighbors. Animosity between neighbors is a very stressful situation. Leave a six pack of Coca Cola Classic with a bow on with a card that says "welcome to the neighborhood! Please let us know if we can be helpful to you in anyway." Have a great week!
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Some people, any age, are like that.
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As an "old fart" I don't use Faecesbook or Witter or any other anti-social media.
Nice play on words there Ian. Just about sums up some of the crap that passes for posts on these social networks.
Our grandaughters mother has some 5-600 "friends" but seems never to have anyone else, other than us, to mind the child while she works or goes out. Not that we complain but it's a 45 minute trip each way at our expense and no fun in winter blizzards.
As far as the original post goes, just ignore the new neighbours or come to accept that the F word is now thrown into daily conversation almost every third word. It merely shows a lack of command of basic language skills. Sadly not corrected sufficiently in the current education curriculum.
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03:29:23pm
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I was a high school teacher for 34 years and retired 4 years ago. I saw generations come and go and each one seemed a bit worse to me - ruder and with less respect. So get used to this sort of thing since it will get more common. Almost everyone seems to be in a huge hurry to get from A to B and will do or say almost anything if you get in the way. Of course I'm an old fart now and maybe I just get upset over anything! Good luck!!!
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i agree with Harvey, somewhere along the line many parents (but not all) simply did not bother to teach their kids manners. We were in Europe late November/early December and we were both deeply impressed how quickly people on trains and trams got up and offered their seats to us.
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re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
I feel this thing about "friends" with the younger generations started decades ago. My daughter was more concerned about her "friends" and what they thought or did meant more to her than family back in the eighties.
The problem started as soon as she started secondary school (age 12). There she met all those other kids. You know the ones that could stay up until three in the morning, got £100 per week allowance, had the latest fashions, had every food allergy on the planet, and knew everything about life. Of course us parents knew absolutely nothing about anything and were more like prison wardens.
Of course when she encountered minor problems her so called "friends" were nowhere to be seen or heard from.
She is now a Social Worker. One day she phoned me to say that when she was advising a client she suddenly realised that what she was saying was the exact advice I had given her at one time. " Oh my god I'm turning into my dad " she thought.
There is nothing new in the Universe.
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It seems that every generation believes the next and following are inferior and worsening. Case in point, I hear myself now repeating the exact same words that my grand and great grandparents were saying many, many decades ago about us!
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We have that kind of discussions too with our 15 years old son: But my friends are allowed to... (fill in the blanks). Many times we try reason and patiently explain why it is different with us, but sometimes one gets fed up with it and the reply is cynical: perhaps you should try to get yourself adopted. Not very pedagogical of course and not what we really want, but we never noticed him thinking that it might actually be a good idea either...
It is hard to get the idea out of his head that it is not a hotel with free cab service. Social media does not help much in that respect.
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re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
Jings! Crivvens! Help Ma Boab!
Are kids today still using "Dads Taxis" ?
I know you want to keep your kids safe and if it means sitting outside some dismal place waiting for the offspring to appear then so be it.
What I did do once was make a couple of "Dads Taxi" signs put them in the car windows while waiting for the "proper little madam" to appear with her "friends". She was NOT pleased, but we had a nice quiet journey home and her drivers duties were somewhat reduced over the next few weeks!!
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I actually think the initial scene is a showcase for how easy it is to speak in ways that make subsequent communication all that more difficult. Two statements: both relatively neutral, but both governed by situations that preceded them.
If it's any consolation, our relationships with neighbors range from anonymity to animosity.
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Maybe she was just trying to proposition you? A prompt response of "No thanks, I am happily married," would be a funny comeback.
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If I said something it would be something like "Oh Really?"
'
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We took a trip last October to London and since I still have a weakened left ankle from a severe sprain two years ago I took a cane with me to help in walking. I was amazed at the level of consideration I got from total strangers, mostly on the tube and buses. Many of those were young people. I couldn't help contrast that with what I see over here. My son living with us is 23 and does not fit the stereotype often applied to his age. We were older parents so maybe that had something to do with it.
So far as the young lady next door is concerned, my referring to her as a 'little twit' may have been in poor taste. She's one of those girls with multi colored hair and wears reflective sunglasses. Nothing wrong with either of those things just a bit jarring to me and the potty mouth sort of adds to the charm.
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24 Apr 2019
12:29:20pm
re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
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08:25:07pm
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The rudeness, contempt for everything and everyone, the lack of morality starts in the highest office in your country. I'm sure the next generation is paying attention to the new norm.
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CF, I'll disagree with you. The rudeness, contempt and lack of morality does not start in the highest office, it starts in the home. To quote one of your countrymen:
"In a democracy, the people get the government they deserve." Alexis De Tocqueville
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"Many young people were so pampered nowadays that they had forgotten that there was such a thing as walking, and they made automatically for the buses… unless they did something, the future for walking was very poor indeed. 1951- Falkirk Herald"
"It’s an irony, but so many of us are a cautious, nervous, conservative crew that some of the elders who five years ago feared that we might come trooping home full of foreign radical ideas are now afraid that the opposite might be too true, and that we could be lacking some of the old American gambling spirit and enterprise.” 1950 - Life"
"Parents themselves were often the cause of many difficulties. They frequently failed in their obvious duty to teach self-control and discipline to their own children.” 1938 - Leeds Mercury"
"We defy anyone who goes about with his eyes open to deny that there is, as never before, an attitude on the part of young folk which is best described as grossly thoughtless, rude, and utterly selfish.” 1925 Daily Mail"
"Whither are the manly vigour and athletic appearance of our forefathers flown? Can these be their legitimate heirs? Surely, no; a race of effeminate, self-admiring, emaciated fribbles can never have descended in a direct line from the heroes of Potiers and Agincourt... 1771 - Town and Country "
Don
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"The rudeness, contempt for everything and everyone, the lack of morality starts in the highest office in your country."
CF, such a comment is arrogant, self-serving and false. The topic being discussed is found all over the world, and has been growing for a long time. There was no need to make a self-serving political comment. I'm sure there are plenty of examples of similar behavior by plenty of politicians in Europe and elsewhere. So knock off the political commentary with the false narrative and attacks against another country, which is rude and shows disrespect and contempt for members here. I know it makes some people feel superior, but in reality it makes the one who posts such drivel look ignorant.
A reminder that political commentary is not permitted in the Discussion Board.
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'
Starting when we are very little, we see the world around us, and we draw conclusions about the world around us: what a mommy-and-daddy look like, what colors of people do what sorts of jobs, who defers to whom, etc.
When exceptions arise - because the people around us (or, more to the point, the people coming after us) are doing things differently - it strikes us at a level well below conscious thought & learned values, eg, "that just ain't right".
Sometimes, these differences are soon understood to be frivolous, eg, the Beatles look like girls.
Sometimes, they might take some getting used to, eg, those guys are holding hands.
But the mathematics are simple:
1) NextGen makes a batch of changes.
2) Some of these challenge conclusions we formed when we were very, very young.
3) NextGen is going to hell.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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Don, the quotes that you posted reminded me of things going back to the 1800s in the philatelic press that I read that predicted the demise of stamp collecting.
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Anecdotal evidence serves to prove little, alas, and only bolsters personal opinion. So I'll do a little bolstering here, with a trio of incidents.
Yesterday, following a family out of our corner shop, their young son (he'd be about 9 years old) made sure to hold the door open for me as I passed through. His family had walked on to the car-park, so he wasn't doing it to impress them. Now where did he learn that? (I had half a mind to catch up with the parents and congratulate them on their son's behaviour, but we tend not to go quite that far in England.)
Behaviour on the London Underground is variable. The visibly struggling older or pregnant person is usually offered a seat, but journeys can be long and uncomfortably crowded, and I confess I have not always given up a cherished seat when probably I should have done. Visiting St Petersburg a fortnight ago, however, I noticed things were different. In that city, men routinely stand for any female traveller, though with none of the little invitational gestures we in England feel necessary to accompany our good manners. True, their metro is not as extensive as London's, and probably not always as crowded, but it is a pleasing custom that cannot be dismissed with easy quips about state-regulated societies and suchlike.
A dozen or so years ago, I walked into a London stamp shop owned by a well-known (I think) gentleman, who wanted to know what I was looking for. As I was looking for nothing in particular, but enjoyed browsing in stamp shops (when they existed!) I answered accordingly. His response was to utter a few choice words and show me the door. The next time I passed that way (Covent Garden, since you ask) his shop no longer existed. I'm sure he retired a wealthy man, and much-respected in philatelic circles. Though not by me.
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While in London a few months back I dropped into the Gibbons shop on the Strand. I wasn't sure what to expect but I was treated very well. I only bought a Concise catalog but was made to feel welcome. I even got to go upstairs and get a glimpse of their auction department.
Guthrum I think I know who you refer to. If I'm right he had a reputation for that sort of thing. He still posts sometimes on another board based 'Down Under'.
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You can see people's attitudes are different in different areas. In the New York / New Jersey metro area, drivers are pretty aggressive and you are involved in a game of chicken to get into another lane. Forget anyone letting you out into the lane from a parking lot!
I went to Denver many years ago and stayed at a hotel that was right next to the Interstate. Every time we exited the hotel, the traffic was backed up with people waiting to enter the Interstate. The first time, my thought was that we'd never get out of the lot. But each and every time, the very first person who could give us a break cheerfully waved us in front of them! Quite a culture shock!
Also when we moved to the Pennsylvania suburbs west of Philadelphia we noticed that people were nicer. People regularly hold doors open for you at stores, and generally are better mannered than in our previous metro area.
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07:55:56am
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You should be careful when discussing good ( or otherwise ) manners. It is often a case of cultural norms.
As an example, many years ago I worked in the Scout Association hostel in London. Now at the time the UK norm was to say "please and thank you" to anything. We had a party of American Scouts who didn't seem to use the words at all. However after a couple of days we noticed that "I want" was usually prefixed by "Sir". This indicated that respect was enunciated somewhat differently, but should be considered equally valid.
As for the opening of doors, I was brought up to always hold the door for a female ( of any age ). Nowadays to do so is sometimes to invite a stream of abuse.
Some of the more strident females appear to be unable to differentiate between equality and courtesy. It is possible to believe in gender equality ( as I do ) without compromising chivalry and good manners.
In one of our classrooms at school was the inscription "Manners Maketh Man"......well it was an all boys school.
Malcolm
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Last week, a teenager turned down the wrong way on a one way street. Of course I was the car going the correct way, and with a one lane road he was upset that I was blocking his way. I told him it was a one way street. He told me to "relax". He said it wasn't that big of a deal. Maybe not that time, but one day/night, he'll do the same thing and get into a head-on collision.
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05:36:56pm
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I am probably going to get crapped on for what I'm about to say, but what the heck! I'm in my 60s and when I was growing up in Canada ( Nova Scotia ) all of the kids I knew had a parent at home during the day and had meals as a family. I think respect was taught at home and there was always a parent around if we screwed up. I was in a single parent home so I was a bid different, my father died when I was very young. I don't remember anyone ever getting divorced, in other words society was very different then. I'm not saying it was better or worse, just different. We both respected and feared many adults we knew - again, different now. Respect now has to be earned and that is often not easy. We cannot expect to get respect from people just because we are older. Major changes in society have changed the way younger people react to us and we have to get used to that - it's not going to change!!! As an ex-teacher, I was sworn at and abused in many ways. And I was a coach for several teams and helped out with social events - God knows how teachers were treated who didn't help the kids out!
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We wouldn't dare yell at or abuse a teacher or coach. We would get kicked out of school or off the team. Then, there would be our parents to get prepared for when we got home. Most likely we wouldn't have been able to sit properly for a month after that. If we got bad grades, it wasn't the teacher's fault, it was ours. My parents would never have gone racing up to the school to accuse the teacher if intentionally giving us bad grades and ruining our chances for a college scholarship, then bringing a lawyer down on the school.
We also would never call non-related adults by their first names. It was always sir, mam, mr., mrs., or miss. Now, informality is the norm.
I have been a sports coach, and the children learned from their parents to disrespect the coaches. In the little league team I coached, the parents demanded that the team be made Little League World Series ready. The boys on the team were no where close to being any sort of a championship team, but it was my fault that they weren't, not the lack of talent on the part of the children.
I am a certified USA Junior Olympics coach for bowling. Several of the children who I coached went on to win major bowling tournaments on the state and national level. Some children that I helped coach went on to international victories. Still, several parents wouldn't let us instruct their children in how to bowl correctly. They want to teach the children, because they were league bowlers and knew how to bowl a certain way that they wanted their children to learn. There really is only one way to bowl correctly, and league bowling with a belly full of beer isn't it.
I have watched the parents as they threw gutter ball after gutter ball "teaching" their children how to bowl. Arrogance, narcissism and selfishness are in control now. Manners and respect do not exist.
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07:19:24pm
re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
Thanks Michael I coached high school boys baseball and softball. Except for smoking and chewing tobacco in the dugouts when we weren't watching, plus a bit of occasional swearing the kids weren't anywhere near as much of a problem as some of the parents. Since it was a high school team I tried as much as possible to let all of the kids to get a chance to play. A couple times we made the provincial championships and them we had to change things a little bit. The kids wanted a chance to win so some kids played a bit more than others. The kids "got it" but the parents didn't. There were several times that parents started yelling at me because their "little Johnny" didn't get enough field time, sometimes cursing and swearing at me to the point where the umps had to intervene. It's easy to see why kids are losing their respect for authority when the parents show that kind of example. I haven't coached for a while now so I guess it is probably worse.
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Before I retired from teaching in 1990, every member of my high school’s basketball team was caught drinking on a school trip, in direct contravention of the team’s (and the school district’s) rules. In a highly principled decision, our principal, Doug Hallman, told the team members that they were no longer welcome at Prince George (BC) Secondary School and would have to enrol at other area high schools.
In my opinion, that was exactly the right response, but the father of one of the boys disagreed. He argued that his son needed a course that was only offered at PGSS. The school board, elected officials all, agreed with the father and forced Doug to allow the boy to continue attending PGSS. I’m sure that father believes he did the right thing.
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11:46:49am
re: New Neighbor Drops the F Bomb on Me
I am always thankful when a person is polite. I am not thankful when a person is rude.
Bruce
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It seems the "New Norm" is to find something or someone to transfer your lacks and failures on.
"Owning It" is often quoted but seldom practiced.
Imagine how little time it took to get to this stage and where it might go from here......
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"Imagine how little time it took to get to this stage and where it might go from here......"
Amen.
Tad
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It's interesting the decline of civilization!
The other day I was driving home to PA from NJ and put on NJ talk radio for the traffic reports. The topic was a published list of the friendliest states.
The two talk show hosts were upset that New Jersey was near the bottom of the list as number 46. Callers then blamed it on the influx of New Yorkers, since NY was the least friendliest state according to the survey.
Pennsylvania was the 18th friendliest state. And a funny thing, we noticed it when we moved here. People would say hello in stores and hold doors open for you. Then we assimilated into the culture and now take it for granted.
A few weeks ago we stayed a week in NJ at my daughters. I went to Wegman's grocery store and noticed how unfriendly everyone was. People didn't say hello, excuse me or any contact they could avoid. They'd look the other way when they passed you in the aisles, or downright glare at you for being in their way. We never noticed that when we lived there!
Today I went to the local Giant supermarket. Yes, Pennsylvania is friendly! People would smile and say hello as you passed them in the aisles. I think I will stay here!
And here's that survey: https://bigseventravel.com/2019/08/the-50-friendliest-states-in-america/
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I wonder where they got the data.
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02:08:17pm
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All these emails remind me of a previous conversation about the state of youth, manners and the overall decline of cilization I had in another lifetime with Plato or was it Aristotle?
Bruce
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#4! What can I say? We'll just have to work a little harder on it to get back up to #1!
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Florida is ranked 42. I think south Florida skews the survey. North of Orlando is like a different state. I can totally see Texas being high on the list. I'm out there for work all the time and the people are noticeably friendly and hospitable. I love Texas.
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Something I’ve noticed since moving to Vancouver and using the city’s excellent transit system: many bus passengers thank the bus driver as they exit the bus. Does that happen in other cities?
Bob
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'
After a few days of driving & errands in Pennsylvania, my grandson & I both remarked on how friendly & open everyone was ... compared to NYC.
New Yorkers thank the bus drivers, hold open doors, etc, under the name of common courtesy ... but that is very different from getting to know the person sitting next to you on the bus. Ever.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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